[RELEASED] New(ish) Scenario: Closing the Kurile Gap (US)

[Yokes]

I went back and rebuilt this scenario with all the wonderful new tools available. Wow, the new features are just amazing. I love the flexibility that lua gives.

Anyways, this scenario is from the book The War That Never Was by Michael A. Palmer. This scenario takes place around Japan during a fictional conventional WWIII in 1988. The Soviets are trying to combine two surface forces south of the Kurile Islands, and the US Navy has to stop them.

Changes from the previous version:
- Smaller: I decided to cut out the action at Kamchatka and move that to its own scenario. That said, this is still a massive scenario.
- Added neutrals: just a few ships, but hopefully it adds a bit of realism. Comments welcome.
- One-sided: I made this version playable from the US side only. I will be making another version playable by USSR only as well. I found that I can make the AI much more intelligent by giving it information it normally wouldn't have (cheating). Plus I fill the screen up with reference points for all the scripted missions, and it makes the screen look cluttered. Better to give the player a blank canvas.

If you are interested in long-duration, campaign-style, complex scenarios, then please give this a shot. I haven't played it through yet myself, but I have tested all the scripting. That said, I probably missed something. I could use some extra eyes to help find the bugs.

Thanks!

Yokes

[Triode]

two questions:
1.Air Operation Tempo - set Sustained is this right? 20h for reload AAW loadout?

2.for Russian planes WCS for surface contact set tight-attack if positive identified as hostile, this lead to attack from Su-27 and Mig-23 on Japan radar and bunkers with guns, is this intended?


Also, as I understand, you guided by "book The War That Never Was by Michael A. Palmer" ?

If so I just want to outline few thing that make scenario look little unrealistic

1.composition of KPUG 2, 1134A-ok , 1155-ok,61M-well not very ok , 56U - really? from reserve of 2nd category?,
more likely instead of project 61M and 56U, in this fast assembled (as I think ) KPUG, it wil be two from eight Pacific Fleet project 1135 ship (actually,for some reasons, there is no ship of this project in scenario)

2.project 641 in Pacific in 89 - more likely it will be project 877 ,there is 12 of them,

3. Names and tactical numbers (Kalanin, really?) well, what can I say, there is really good site where you can find name of Russian ships and tactical numbers, also date of commission and decommission, and what ship serve on what fleet
http://russian-ships.info/eng/
Just to avoid ships from future like K-419 [:)]

Of course if you want scenario "by the book" ignore second part of my post

[Yokes]

ORIGINAL: Triode

two questions:
1.Air Operation Tempo - set Sustained is this right? 20h for reload AAW loadout?

Yes, since I wanted the player to feel like this is the opening day of WWIII, which will not be over in a day. However, I (hopefully) made the setting player-editable, so the player can switch to surge if they want. If that's not working please let me know.

2.for Russian planes WCS for surface contact set tight-attack if positive identified as hostile, this lead to attack from Su-27 and Mig-23 on Japan radar and bunkers with guns, is this intended?

No, not intended. I will have to check the WPA settings again. Thanks for the heads up!

Also, as I understand, you guided by "book The War That Never Was by Michael A. Palmer" ?

If so I just want to outline few thing that make scenario look little unrealistic

1.composition of KPUG 2, 1134A-ok , 1155-ok,61M-well not very ok , 56U - really? from reserve of 2nd category?,
more likely instead of project 61M and 56U, in this fast assembled (as I think ) KPUG, it wil be two from eight Pacific Fleet project 1135 ship (actually,for some reasons, there is no ship of this project in scenario)

2.project 641 in Pacific in 89 - more likely it will be project 877 ,there is 12 of them,

3. Names and tactical numbers (Kalanin, really?) well, what can I say, there is really good site where you can find name of Russian ships and tactical numbers, also date of commission and decommission, and what ship serve on what fleet
http://russian-ships.info/eng/
Just to avoid ships from future like K-419 [:)]

Of course if you want scenario "by the book" ignore second part of my post

Yes, I am basing the order of battle based upon the book, which took some liberties with the actual dates of service for some of the ships. However, your information is fantastic, and I will go back through the book to see if I missed something. Also, there are times where the author says "three frigates" without giving class names. That's where I have to guess, and I probably guessed wrong.

Again, thanks for the great feedback!

Yokes

[Triode]

ORIGINAL: Yokes


Yes, since I wanted the player to feel like this is the opening day of WWIII, which will not be over in a day. However, I (hopefully) made the setting player-editable, so the player can switch to surge if they want. If that's not working please let me know.

Currently not player-editable, actually it is interesting question should it be editable , I find that 20h reload time force me to made more careful strike planning, and generally more interesting game.
From other side surge operation ,theoretically , should be more dynamic.
Choices, choices...

also if it be player editable,after turn into surge other side will stay in sustained which will be not very funny

[magi]

I'm going to try this....

[magi]

There is a lot of stuff... I like that…however there's no stated intent of red force in the briefing… So therefore I do not understand the disposition of blue force… I know it's mission is to destroy red force… But what is red force doing… I know the red force groups are trying to join up… But where where are they going and what are they doing… I will read the brief again… Maybe I am missing something…

[magi]

Delete delete delete darn how do I delete this…

[Yokes]

ORIGINAL: magi

There is a lot of stuff... I like that…however there's no stated intent of red force in the briefing… So therefore I do not understand the disposition of blue force… I know it's mission is to destroy red force… But what is red force doing… I know the red force groups are trying to join up… But where where are they going and what are they doing… I will read the brief again… Maybe I am missing something…

Clearly I need to improve the briefing...

Thanks for the feedback!

[magi]

Thank you.... I believe I'm going to really like this once a gets tuned up…

[magi]

the Japanese aaw patrol units were were flying around on afterburn until bingo.... soo... to make them act in a more reasonable manner i set up three patrol zones with prosecution areas... north.. center.. south....

[Yokes]

I fixed a bunch of broken events and re-balanced some of the forces. I updated the file in the original post, and I'm adding it here for convenience.

Yokes

[Lawdog1700]

Played the scenario a couple times, and here are my observations (based upon the newer version, I played the original twice and the newer one last night without completing it).

1. The Russian aircraft seem to orbit over the Japanese cities/radar installations but they do nothing to those installations. Of course, your scenario states that Japan will remain neutral in this conflict but then why would the Russians violate Japanese airspace to orbit over their cities unless they were up to no good?

2. The U.S. planes take 20 hours to re-arm for an ATA role in this mission? 20 hours to re-arm for ATA is way too long. In a situation like this, the U.S. Air Force and Navy would prioritize their fighter cover and fly heavy CAP over Japan. I agree that after a surprise Russian/Soviet attack, as in the scenario, the U.S. response with respect to a counter-strike might take some time, but air-to-air would be rushed whether pilots or planning staff wanted that or not. Am I wrong?

3. In the new version, the Japanese are listed as "Neutral" rather than "Allies". The problem I have encountered a few times (causing me to load autosaves on 3 occasions last night, and eventually give up, is that Japan becomes my enemy. The first time, it was my mistake, for ordering a manual attack against targets I "boxed" by dragging a box with the mouse over another Neutral ship. Ok, that was my fault. Then, I started over and about 20 minutes of real time passes (I cannot get much above a 1:1 time compression on this one, even set to 1:5, due to the size of the scenario, one of my weapons apparently misses a target and the Japanese suddenly switch sides. It did not appear that I even hit a Japanese target. Not sure what happened there. The third time, all the Japanese turned red and I'm not sure why. So, I'm not sure what's going on, and why the Japanese keep switching sides on me. Seemed more realistic when the Japanese were "Allied" status.

Anyway, this is my feedback.

[Yokes]

ORIGINAL: Lawdog1700

Played the scenario a couple times, and here are my observations (based upon the newer version, I played the original twice and the newer one last night without completing it).

1. The Russian aircraft seem to orbit over the Japanese cities/radar installations but they do nothing to those installations. Of course, your scenario states that Japan will remain neutral in this conflict but then why would the Russians violate Japanese airspace to orbit over their cities unless they were up to no good?

Sorry, I forgot to fix this. It will be fixed in the final version. (I rushed trying to get this out prior to going on a business trip.)

2. The U.S. planes take 20 hours to re-arm for an ATA role in this mission? 20 hours to re-arm for ATA is way too long. In a situation like this, the U.S. Air Force and Navy would prioritize their fighter cover and fly heavy CAP over Japan. I agree that after a surprise Russian/Soviet attack, as in the scenario, the U.S. response with respect to a counter-strike might take some time, but air-to-air would be rushed whether pilots or planning staff wanted that or not. Am I wrong?

This is by design. This is the opening day of WWIII, and I wanted the player to be thinking about having to deal with a long-term war, and not just a one-day operation. Also, this is not a surprise situation since there was some political crisis that precipitated the conflict.

Personally, I find the sustained operations model is a much more realistic model of how aircraft would operate. As someone else said, it really makes one think about launching aircraft since they will be unavailable for a long time afterwards. (The old Harpoon days really screwed up my concept of aircraft operations.)

3. In the new version, the Japanese are listed as "Neutral" rather than "Allies". The problem I have encountered a few times (causing me to load autosaves on 3 occasions last night, and eventually give up, is that Japan becomes my enemy. The first time, it was my mistake, for ordering a manual attack against targets I "boxed" by dragging a box with the mouse over another Neutral ship. Ok, that was my fault. Then, I started over and about 20 minutes of real time passes (I cannot get much above a 1:1 time compression on this one, even set to 1:5, due to the size of the scenario, one of my weapons apparently misses a target and the Japanese suddenly switch sides. It did not appear that I even hit a Japanese target. Not sure what happened there. The third time, all the Japanese turned red and I'm not sure why. So, I'm not sure what's going on, and why the Japanese keep switching sides on me. Seemed more realistic when the Japanese were "Allied" status.

I had to do this to keep the Japanese neutral until their scripted entry into the war. (They previously saw the USSR shoot at the US and then turned hostile.) Unfortunately, it does make it possible for the US to accidentally turn the Japanese hostile to them. (I think I can use lua to fix this automatically...)

I didn't have this happen in my play through, but maybe I just got lucky.

Anyway, this is my feedback.

And I greatly appreciate it!

Yokes

[magi]

I agree with law dog..... Japanese posture is unreal… They are our allies… and how can it be… That the Soviets flyover Japanese territory with armed military aircraft while they are in a wartime situation… And it would be not considered an act of war on Japan… or at least Japan would defend their airspace..
I decided to totally dominate the gap.... While attacking the red bases North of Hokido.... I discovered the northern red group just parked north west of the gap..... That is just kind of weird… I think it would be more realistic to have them moving south towards the gap to meet and aid the group going north to Break out into the Pacific....
One big Japanese AAW patrol zone doesn't work very well… I made them into three…
Composition of Air Force assets seems unbalance… there are no support assets… No tankers... No EW/ECW.... no AEW .... In the Northern half of Japan…

If you look at the situation from the Soviets side… with the object of having their naval assets at sea in the Pacific…. The ideal for them would've been to do so before the outbreak of hostilities which they initiated… So they could've planned for this…
However that being not the situation… And now they have to fight their way through the gap…
If you look at the geography and blue force disposition… The only way they can break out successfully… Is to do destroy and then dominate the battle space over all Hokido and south of the La Perouse Straits.... Which they can do with land-based air assets and missile batteries… Then they can support their fleet with aircraft and dominate the whole area around the gap… that would put the Soviets on the offense where they have a chance and would be in control… Currently they are in the defense… So from their side the whole thing is backwards....

[magi]

After saying all this… I would like you to know that I am having fun playing the scenario… But I've been going into the editor and doing things more my way… For the fun of it…

[Yokes]

ORIGINAL: magi

I agree with law dog..... Japanese posture is unreal… They are our allies… and how can it be… That the Soviets flyover Japanese territory with armed military aircraft while they are in a wartime situation… And it would be not considered an act of war on Japan… or at least Japan would defend their airspace..

The posture comes from the book. I also thought it strange that they would start neutral, but the book doesn't get into the politics of how the war started. I figure the author of the book is more qualified than me on these matters and I just trust them.

I do agree with the "Soviet aircraft flying over Japan at will and Japan just accepting it" thing. I think I can fix this. I recently discovered that you can move reference points with lua, so I have some ideas for how to make this work.

I decided to totally dominate the gap.... While attacking the red bases North of Hokido.... I discovered the northern red group just parked north west of the gap..... That is just kind of weird… I think it would be more realistic to have them moving south towards the gap to meet and aid the group going north to Break out into the Pacific....

Are you talking about the convoy? They are headed to Petro. They don't have the combat power to take on any surface forces. Where they stationary? They should be moving...

One big Japanese AAW patrol zone doesn't work very well… I made them into three…

Personally I don't think the problem is that it needs multiple zones. The problem is the fighters in central Japan just take off after targets 500 miles away on afterburner and run out of gas halfway there. (I don't have any suggestions on how that logic should work, so I'm not complaining.)

Composition of Air Force assets seems unbalance… there are no support assets… No tankers... No EW/ECW.... no AEW .... In the Northern half of Japan…

The US has lots of tankers/AEW/EW in central Japan. What do you think is missing?

If you look at the situation from the Soviets side… with the object of having their naval assets at sea in the Pacific…. The ideal for them would've been to do so before the outbreak of hostilities which they initiated… So they could've planned for this…
However that being not the situation… And now they have to fight their way through the gap…

I agree, but that's what the book's author wrote. I think it makes for a fun situation. [:)]

If you look at the geography and blue force disposition… The only way they can break out successfully… Is to do destroy and then dominate the battle space over all Hokido and south of the La Perouse Straits.... Which they can do with land-based air assets and missile batteries… Then they can support their fleet with aircraft and dominate the whole area around the gap… that would put the Soviets on the offense where they have a chance and would be in control… Currently they are in the defense… So from their side the whole thing is backwards....

I agree with your assessment of the Soviet situation. But I'm surprised you find them on the defensive initially. With Japan neutral I think they are on the offensive and the US is on the defensive. How long have you played? I did put some Surprises from the Soviet side that trigger later in the scenario.

Yokes

[Yokes]

ORIGINAL: magi

After saying all this… I would like you to know that I am having fun playing the scenario… But I've been going into the editor and doing things more my way… For the fun of it…

[:D]

The whole point is to have fun, so modifying it to make it more fun for you is totally fair game.

Thanks for the great feedback!

Yokes

[magi]

You're welcome… And thank you for all your work making this cool scenario…

[Yokes]

Updated version attached here and in the OP.

Fixed the "fighters circling radar/SAM sites" problem. I also made it so that Soviet violation of Japanese airspace will make them turn hostile. I hope that helps with the realism factor. (Thanks Lawdog1700 and Magi!)

I have one more issue with two Japanese formations that needs fixing, but otherwise I think this is almost ready.

As always, feedback and suggestions are welcome.

Yokes

[magi]

Way cool.... Thank you for designing this scenario… It's pretty darn big… And I know that's a lot of work… What a guy… What a guy…i'm going to load it up and check it out…