Mines

[Lobster]

I realize there are field fortifications and I guess minefields are somehow part of those field works but, mines are not represented are they? There is no movement penalty for moving through a fortified hex. There are no casualties for moving through a fortified hex. Yet the manual says once a hex is fortified it stays that way to some extent. So where are the mines? At 2.5 kilometers and 6 hour turns they would have an impact.

Perhaps in TOAW4 mines could finally be represented through casualties and movement penalties.

[Meyer1]

Problem is that there were fortifications including plenty of mines, and other with little or none mines. So I think would be nice to have the ability to place minefields, perhaps as an option of engineer units.
About no-defended fortifications, I don't think they should make units take casualties/movement penalty as they pass through in most scales, perhaps some delay/little casualties in smaller scales as you mention, as all I've read indicates that obstacles were as good as useless if they were no contested by the defender side.

[shunwick]

Minefields seem to be most effective on civilians long after the war has ended. [:(]

For military operations on land, the problem is assessing their battlefield effectiveness at an operational scale. At most, I suspect you could argue for a tiny movement cost penalty at 2.5Km x 6 hour or a tiny casualty cost at the same scale, and both depending on which nation is the attacker. Any map scale/time scale larger than that and the operational effectiveness would seem to be so negligible that nothing is required. A funneling effect is probably the most that could be reasoned. More exclusion zones and a minefield graphic might be better in some situations than movement/casualty cost. Although that would limit the flexibility that players have now.

Minefields at sea are another matter entirely.

Representation of minefields on land on a tactical simulation are important. But at an operational scale?

Best wishes,
Steve

[Lobster]

A small river delays a unit for only a small amount of time and causes no casualties yet there they are on an operational scale. What rivers are displayed is up to the scenario designer. The same should be true of mines. What would a North African campaign be without the massive minefields? Germany used vast quantities of mines as a cheap force multiplier. Mines are not merely tactical weapons any more than fortifications are.

[Meyer1]

Well, regarding AT mines, after gunfire, were biggest threat to the tanks in WW2, IIRC were responsible to 20% of allies AFV losses in WW2. Mines killed way more tanks than did the aircraft. I think mines deserve to be represented in a game, while operational, takes account of individual equipment in the units to calculate combats.
As for mines as part of fortifications, maybe we need more than three level of defensive deployment (D/E/F).