When to use Axis O-chits?

[Grotius]

In my games, the Allies (especially USA) can build multiple O-chits, it seems. But they are much more precious for Japan and Germany.

I know this is probably an impossible question, but I seem to make suboptimal use of my chits, so I'll ask anyway: Do you all have any general suggestions on how Japan and Germany should use them? Barbarossa/Spain for Germany; super-Combined Pearl Harbor Day for Japan? Many thanks in advance.

[nilssone85]

Definitely the super-combined for Japan. Capturing all the islands with the divisions riding on cruisers on the surprise.

The Germans are trickier. In our games one is usually needed for France, but that is just us.

[paulderynck]

Many German players try and save their chits for Barb, but that can result in 1 or 2 turns of delay before France can be conquered. I've seen the Germans use both chits against France.

[Centuur]

It depends a little bit on the strategy the Euroaxis chooses. One is usually used in France. The second one is either for Gibraltar (if a close the Med strategy is taken) or in the USSR if a Barbarossa 1941 is done.

Sometimes, if a German player gets very lucky during S/O 1939 with lots of good weather and has set up quite aggressive against France he might be able to save the chit while taking France. However, he needs to be very lucky indeed.

[Klydon]

Pretty much agree with the others. Japan chit for the surprise round and as many amphibious landings as you can make to grab as much territory/key spots as you can.

I would use one in France as the Germans in most cases when the weather is clear after you have gotten into Belgium, etc and can bring max weight against the French lines. I have seen games where the Germans try to be miserly with the chits and the battle for France just draws out a lot longer than intended. Good use of a chit can shorten the war with France by a lot and time is simply something the Axis do not have an abundance of. Getting the battle of France over with fast allows other options like cleaning up the Balkans, sending an expeditionary force to Africa and/or going for Spain, etc.

It may not be good play, but I will build some as the Axis. The biggest reason for this is to have that threat hang over your Allied opponent, especially in Russia. Their defensive set up will change if the Axis happen to have an offensive chit vs an Axis that doesn't have one.

[Grotius]

Thanks very much for all the helpful replies. As I guessed, I've been too cautious with my O-chits. I didn't use one in France, and Germany took at least one turn too many to take it, slowing things down a lot. I'm going to try using them in Barbarossa now, but next game, I'll use at least one in France.

Japan hasn't declared war in the Pacific yet, so I still have a chance to use her super-combined. I need to spend more time pairing divisions with ships, though!

[brian brian]

It can be helpful to use one in China, when Winter is Coming and one of the Chinese factions has just one city left, though that is a pretty tough call to make.

[Finarfïn]

ORIGINAL: brian brian

" when Winter is Coming ....., though that is a pretty tough call to make.

Fin

[paulderynck]

pretty stark reply, isn't it?

[CanInf]

I blew the Japanese O-chit on taking Chungking. That led to the complete collapse of the south and reducing the Chinese to a single build point. Was it worth it? Yes, at the time it was. War in the Pacific was rapidly approaching and I had nowhere near enough troops to use the super combined to great effect. This way I released a ton of troops from China, and crippled Chinese production for the better part of the war. If I had been smashing my head against chungking turn after turn in low odds attacks, I would never have:
- reduced chinese production
- released the troops
- narrowed the front
The lack of a super combined was enormously painful, but I partially made up for it by landing heavily and with lots of big units at a few key targets (Singapore, NEI and Manila). These fell quickly and easily with the extra 6-8 corps from China.
If you can put China out of the war, or cut China's production by 1/2 or more. I think it is worth it. Mind you, you don't usually get the opportunity.

[Jagdtiger14]

Super combined for Japan, but as CanInf points out, sometimes its worth it to do other things...what he did in China was worth more than the 15 Japanese BP's to build the O-chit. I think you have to look at it from an opportunity cost perspective. BP's are the third most important thing in WiF: 1. Time, and 2. Strategic position.

Germany...with average luck and results, and with a Fall Gelb...can get away with not using any O-chits in France. If you are doing a Barbarossa, then you need at least one o-chit for 1941, and at least 1 for 1942, and then build one to keep in reserve to hang over the head of the Allies (USSR should do the same thing to Germany). I would be very tempted to use another one in the Med (pre-Barb)...to get either Gibraltar, or Syria.

So, if you use zero in France, I would still buy 1-2 more min.

[Grotius]

Hmm, now I'm wondering if I'm doing the mechanics of O-chits right. I took a land action as Germany (in Barbarossa), and I designated Guderian as my O-chit HQ. I thought I would get the chance to designate which units would be doubled, but I didn't, and I didn't see any doubling. Also, at the end of turn, Guderian isn't disorganized. Maybe I messed something up? I'm pretty sure I've done this right before. Maybe I forgot to hit a confirming "OK" when choosing my Land action.

[paulderynck]

Units in range of Guderian may be selected for doubling by right clicking on them when declaring combats - similar to how you select units to use an engineer benefit.

But if you spent the chit on Guderian, he should be disorganized after the re-org phase, indeed you'll want to use all his re-org value if he's face-up after combat because he will be disorganized anyway. Maybe there's a bug there that is triggered by not having any units doubled.

Usually for a Land O-chit you'll want to choose your highest re-org value HQs: Manstein for Germany, Zhukov for the USSR, Eisenhower for the USA, etc. Of course there are situations where opportunity knocks and they aren't close enough, so that's why I say "usually".

[Grotius]

Thanks, Paul. I didn't think of using the right-click menu; I thought I'd get the option to increase attack value on the combat form.

I still don't know whether the turn actually consumed my O-chit or not. Is there any way to see how many O-chits one has left? I can't find them in my Pools.

And yeah, Guderian is still organized, even though it's now the next (Allied) impulse. If it does turn out that I've consumed my O-chit, and he was never disorganized, then I suppose that is a bug, albeit a low-priority one. Not too many players are likely to repeat my foolishness!

[paulderynck]

To see if you still have an O-chit, press CTRL-Q and select the Reserve Pool. Any unused pilots and O-chits for the major powers will be listed off to the right.

[alexvand]

My favourite use of an o-chit is when on the defensive.

Pick the chit up from the board. Finger it. Count ranges from Manstein (Or Zhukov) or Guderian (or Koniev) total some factors, look at fighter ranges, count ranges for your tac, etc... Roll the chit around in your hand. Scratch your chin. Say, "Not just yet." Put the chit back down.

Rinse and repeat.

Having one o-chit on hand on defense makes the offense that much more cautious. Never use it, just threaten to.

Part of this game is also psychological. (Paras fill the same roll, so can MAR sitting in port on a transport, so can a fast carrier fleet sitting in port ready to strike.)

[Grotius]

Sort of like a fleet in being, eh, Alex?

Paul: Thanks for the tip. I checked, and indeed Germany now has only one O-chit left. So this does seem like a minor, low-priority bug: if you use a Land O-chit, and then foolishly don't ever double any land unit's attack power, the O-chitted HQ does NOT become disorganized. I guess I'll go ahead and report it, but I think Steve's got many more important tasks on his list.

[paulderynck]

ORIGINAL: alex_van_d

My favourite use of an o-chit is when on the defensive.

Pick the chit up from the board. Finger it. Count ranges from Manstein (Or Zhukov) or Guderian (or Koniev) total some factors, look at fighter ranges, count ranges for your tac, etc... Roll the chit around in your hand. Scratch your chin. Say, "Not just yet." Put the chit back down.

Rinse and repeat.

Having one o-chit on hand on defense makes the offense that much more cautious. Never use it, just threaten to.

Part of this game is also psychological. (Paras fill the same roll, so can MAR sitting in port on a transport, so can a fast carrier fleet sitting in port ready to strike.)

This reminds me of the golf handicap of 2 gotchas.