The In-depth Analysis are scaring me

[balto]

I never got into TOAW because (as most Matrix people know) you need to be a full time student of the TOAW forum to understand it. As I see more and more of these "In Depth Analysis" I see people responding to them with informed questions. I do not have any TOAW experience and I do not have the slightest idea what any of these posts are about. I imagine from these posts that the manual will assume you already know these things.

Whatever the manual turns out to be can you put it in WORD so that other veterans and maybe some newbies (possibly me) could redraft or add sections to it, then post the changes/additions to the forum and get forum feedback on it?

The end result is a comprehensive manual that anyone can use. Sure it will take a while, but it is a volunteer effort that could open this up to others (Steam) that do not want to study forums.

Thanks

[Tamas]

One of the goals behind TOAWIV and its new UI is to help ease a newcomer into it.

As a wargame of such complexity and flexibility, there are things to learn of course, but I'd urge you not to be discouraged by the series veterans' discussions here - the game is far easier to pick up and have fun with than you seem to think.

Heck, when I started with the series myself, many, many years ago, it took me YEARS to finally sit down and read up online on the turn time mechanic (now much streamlined under Battlefield Timestamps). But lacking that detailed information did not stop me from having tons of fun and enacting successful operations. I even remember winning a PBEM game and holding my own in the rest that I played!

As for the manual itself it will, of course, NOT be written assuming previous knowledge of the series.

Also, we are planning on preparing a few short videos to explain the basics to newcomers, as an extra help.

[sPzAbt653]

I'll second that. I started with TOAW in 2002 and did not look for a forum until 2007, and that was for an Editor question ! So I had 5 years of fun without knowing anything but what was in the Manual [127 pages of held in hand paper stapled together].

[r6kunz]

Thanks for your interest in TOAW IV.
Is see from your bio you are not new to the computer sim world. I image you will have no trouble with TOAW IV. Do not let the TOAW Forum topics scare you. Mostly guys on the design end of things and it can get a bit esoteric. And do not be taken aback by the manual. Again a lot of designer/editor info. I anticipate a quick start guide to the game and a couple of tutorials scenarios.

The scenario library is incredible. Each highly detailed and documented. The new interface makes Battle Planning much easier and logical. Stay tuned...

And Steve Sill (aka sPZAbt653 in the above post) has a series of intro videos for TOAW III on YouTube and we may see a sequel to TOAW IV.

Cheers
Rob Kunz

[calgar]

I never got into TOAW because (as most Matrix people know) you need to be a full time student of the TOAW forum to understand it. As I see more and more of these "In Depth Analysis" I see people responding to them with informed questions. I do not have any TOAW experience and I do not have the slightest idea what any of these posts are about. I imagine from these posts that the manual will assume you already know these things.

+1

Wanted to open a thread with a similar tone, but so far I thought I wouldn't get much agreement.

Something that I found incredibly difficult is to find out what belongs to what. In other words, making sense of the counters and finding out which group of counters form a Division and how they relate withing the command structure. Will this become easier, i.e. a color code will be introduced similar to WITE?

Edit: FYI, I just fired up TOAW III to see if my perception changed, and my comments were based on trying to get into the Jutland WWIII scenario, and Modern Korea.

Cheers

[Tamas]

When you select a unit, all units in the same formation get highlighted by a dark round marker under them.


There are also colour coding of counters, but how it is used depends on the scenario designer. The highlighting above is always present however.

[sPzAbt653]

Might check this out, if you haven't already:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SN5KL0moec

[ncc1701e]

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v$*à

[ncc1701e]

ORIGINAL: ncc1701e

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Sorry guys, this is the first post of my little girl on the forum...... Smart isn't she?[:)]

[calgar]

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That sums up all I know about TOATW

@sPzJAbt653

Thanks for the link, will have a look at that.

[Zap]

ORIGINAL: ncc1701e

ORIGINAL: ncc1701e

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v$*à

Sorry guys, this is the first post of my little girl on the forum...... Smart isn't she?[:)]

Brought a tear to my eye. Your 3 year old girl (although she was unable to express it in legible words)has gravitated to the war game site. Take it as a sign, she is destined to be one of the great turn based war game players of all times!

[Meyer1]

Obviously, is not recommended to a new player to the series to begin with an "in dept" view of the rules/features of TOAW before learning the basics. So don`t be scared, most TOAW players never reach this level of understanding but that doesn't stop them to enjoy the game.

[balto]

The Product Page screenshot of the 6 day war: Does it matter that the M51 Sherman stats in no way correlate to the UNIT REPORT stats? For example, the soft AP of the UNIT REPORT is 17, the M51 (which is only a portion of the UNIT) has soft AP of 29?

I do not need an explanation, but is there truly a way to figure this out? Or is this one of those, "Well the 17 and 9 on the counter are abstractions, you have to play several 100 hours until you get a feel because there is no way you can figure out what is going on under the hood."

This is not a negative post, I just wanted to know that if you wanted to take the time, could you easily figure out the math?

[Lobster]

ORIGINAL: balto

The Product Page screenshot of the 6 day war: Does it matter that the M51 Sherman stats in no way correlate to the UNIT REPORT stats? For example, the soft AP of the UNIT REPORT is 17, the M51 (which is only a portion of the UNIT) has soft AP of 29?

I do not need an explanation, but is there truly a way to figure this out? Or is this one of those, "Well the 17 and 9 on the counter are abstractions, you have to play several 100 hours until you get a feel because there is no way you can figure out what is going on under the hood."

This is not a negative post, I just wanted to know that if you wanted to take the time, could you easily figure out the math?

UNIT REPORT. Not M51 Sherman report which is below the UNIT REPORT window. The unit report is an amalgamation of all of the equipment in the UNIT, not an individual weapons system that is part of the unit. There are many other pieces of equipment in that UNIT that are not M51 Shermans.

[Meyer1]

ORIGINAL: Lobster

ORIGINAL: balto

The Product Page screenshot of the 6 day war: Does it matter that the M51 Sherman stats in no way correlate to the UNIT REPORT stats? For example, the soft AP of the UNIT REPORT is 17, the M51 (which is only a portion of the UNIT) has soft AP of 29?

I do not need an explanation, but is there truly a way to figure this out? Or is this one of those, "Well the 17 and 9 on the counter are abstractions, you have to play several 100 hours until you get a feel because there is no way you can figure out what is going on under the hood."

This is not a negative post, I just wanted to know that if you wanted to take the time, could you easily figure out the math?

UNIT REPORT. Not M51 Sherman report which is below the UNIT REPORT window. The unit report is an amalgamation of all of the equipment in the UNIT, not an individual weapons system that is part of the unit. There are many other pieces of equipment in that UNIT that are not M51 Shermans.

And.. you can play without taking a look at the unit report.

[balto]

Lobster, I understand. For example, the Sherman is a 29, how can the entire unit be lower (17). I appreciate both of your responses. I do not want to get flamed here, so I am good. No more questions on TOAW for me.

[Rosseau]

quote:

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HA! I actually thought that was some sort of algebraic equation regarding TOAW3. Obviously, your daughter is already smarter than me.

[Meyer1]

ORIGINAL: balto

Lobster, I understand. For example, the Sherman is a 29, how can the entire unit be lower (17). I appreciate both of your responses. I do not want to get flamed here, so I am good. No more questions on TOAW for me.

From TOAW III manual

These Strengths are simply the sums of the total Strengths in
each category for all equipment assigned to the unit, multiplied
by the unit’s Morale (see below), scaled to fit the game displays.
The unit’s actual internal Strengths, used for all game calculations
but not displayed, are much larger numbers. At the low end
(displayed unit strengths less than three), there can be quite a
bit of real difference between units that show similar displayed
Strengths.

I guess some players may want a more detailed explanation, so maybe you have a point there. I don't think you were (of will) flamed, and please go on with your questions. We can use some action on this forum.

[budd]

Just get Mr. Sill working on some new video's[:D] .. I don't know if anyone here has Decisive Campaigns Barbarossa but they had in game tutorials video's, short 3-5 minute video's you could access from the help tab in game. I thought this was a great idea, shot below.

[Lobster]

ORIGINAL: balto

Lobster, I understand. For example, the Sherman is a 29, how can the entire unit be lower (17). I appreciate both of your responses. I do not want to get flamed here, so I am good. No more questions on TOAW for me.

No one is being flamed. The Shermans make up only 19% of the total equipment. If you have 100 guys and 19 have rifles while the other 81 throw rocks how can you say the rock throwers are as powerful as the guys with rifles? The rock throwers will water down the overall strength of the whole.