USA won't join?

[dave123]

Multiplayer game, I'm allied. It's Feb 42. My opponent invaded England, but it has not fallen yet. He has had some diplo hits on the USA, but none in quite awhile. The USA was at 30% readiness for a long time, pearl harbor made it go up to 49, but it has not gone up at all since pearl. The USSR (just joined this turn) at least they went up a few points each turn, but the USA has not been doing that at all. SO two turns after pearl, and they have not went up a single point.

Is this a bug? I can't believe that after pearl,and knowing that England is in dire straits with German units all over the island, that the USA doesn't even seem to care?

[Christolos]

I'm not sure I understand why Russia just joined the Allies in Feb 42...is this right? Were there any diplo points (that you know of) used against Russia to delay her entry. If so, it would seem that your opponent is adept at using diplo points and may have used more than you think to keep the US from joining...

C

[Sugar]

This late entrance of the SU is not uncommon, if 1. France decided to ban the communist and 2. the Allies decided to send an expedioncorps to Finnland. If in addition the Axis holds back DoWs, like choosing the events to get Denmark and Norway, DoW the Netherlands, but waiting for Belgium to join the Allies, than the SU stays at ca. 12-15% until the end of 40. The hit for a successfull Sealion is small.

[Leadwieght]

It seems odd that the USSR stayed out until so late. What was the situation in North Africa? USSR and USA both increase their mobilization in reaction to Axis forces nearing Alexandria, which happens at some point in most games.

Spain joining the Axis and also any land attacks on Gib. each have a significant effect on USA mobilization. I'm guessing that didn't happen either.

But I thought I read that version 1.08 had increased the automatic Soviet per-turn mobilization increase after June 1941, regardless of the situation.

[dave123]

Thanx for the info. With all respect, the main issue is the USA not entering and the fact that they are not even gaining readiness the past few turns. Soviet Union, I understand, which seems the most suprizing to you guys.

I will address your questions.

Spain joined axis and took Gibralter.
axis did not take Norway.
axis got beat pretty bad in Africa, never made any gains (I've kicked them out).
Seems my opponent has put all money into diplo and English invasion and massed air.
And yes, he got several diplo hits in Russia. And yes I did the Finnish expedition and it was successful.

None of this explains why the USA is not gaining readiness in 1942. Perhaps understandable that they have not joined (though suprizing), but they are not even gaining readiness. Was at 30, and pearl sent it to 49, where it has stayed.

Each time that the diplo succeeds, I see a popup. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm thinking that it does not matter how many he has in the USA, only when they hit - and that I can see.

[Leadwieght]

Hi dave,

You are right, the main issue is that US mob. seems to be stuck. Sorry I didn't understand your point.

My understanding of how diplo chits work is that the more you put in, the greater chance of a favorable movement (increase or decrease of mob., depending on whether the targeted country is leaning "pro-you" or "anti-you"). But it's handled through a random-event check each turn; if the game engine "rolls the dice" and determines that you made the odds to get a diplo hit, then the mobilization of the targeted country changes and the other side gets a notification. The other side can decrease the odds by putting in diplo chits against the same targeted country (though of course you don't know for sure which country your opponent has targeted)

I don't think having more diplo chits invested will, apart from the mechanism I described, slow or stop any automatically scripted increase in mobilization. And I thought that the game engine had scripted slow but steady increases in pro-Allied mobilization for both the US and the USSR after a certain point. But I'm not sure if that's true.

I generally play a very aggro. game as the Axis, and tend to trigger both US and USSR entrance pretty early. Perhaps your opponent has found a bit of a loophole. Curious to see how it works out.

[BillRunacre]

Hi

This sounds like some Mobilization_3 scripts have been removed or turned off.

The two scripts below are set to fire in ALL games irrespective of whether you are playing the AI or a human opponent.

Please can you check that these scripts exist in your game and that they are turned on?

When in the game, go to Options -> Advanced -> Scripts and check that an X appears on the right hand side.


Depending on what you find, I would consider asking your opponent to declare war on the USA, if not now then no later than (say) May of 1942.

{
#NAME= 1941 (USA->Allies)
#POPUP=
#IMAGE=
#SOUND=
#FLAG= 1
#TYPE= 2
#AI= 0
#GV= 1[1,100]
#LINK= 0[0]
#LEVEL= 0
#COUNTRY_ID= 115
#TRIGGER= 100
#DATE= 1941/01/01
;1-2% mobilization increase towards Allies
#MOBILIZATION= [1,2] [2]
;Set variable conditions:
;1st Line - UK politically aligned with Allies and not surrendered AND
;2nd Line - USSR politically aligned with Allies and not surrendered
#VARIABLE_CONDITION= 112 [2] [100] [0]
#VARIABLE_CONDITION= 116 [2] [100] [0]
}

{
#NAME= 1942 (USA->Allies)
#POPUP=
#IMAGE=
#SOUND=
#FLAG= 1
#TYPE= 2
#AI= 0
#GV= 1[1,100]
#LINK= 0[0]
#LEVEL= 0
#COUNTRY_ID= 115
#TRIGGER= 100
#DATE= 1942/01/01
;1-2% activation increase towards Allies
#MOBILIZATION= [1,2] [2]
;Set variable conditions:
;1st Line - UK politically aligned with Allies and not surrendered AND
;2nd Line - USSR politically aligned with Allies and not surrendered
#VARIABLE_CONDITION= 112 [2] [100] [0]
#VARIABLE_CONDITION= 116 [2] [100] [0]
}

[crispy131313]

Bill, the Soviets were not 100% until Feb 42' so the mobilization 3 scripts were not firing.

[BillRunacre]

Ah, of course, thanks for pointing that out crispy131313, that's why the US wasn't increasing in Mobilization each turn.

In which case the scripts are working as they should be.

[dave123]

update, usa finally started going up after several turns. opponent surrendered when russians joined as he had all his eggs in the england basket, so I will never know when they might have joined.

i really think this should be tweaked, however.

[BillRunacre]

Thanks dave123. We could perhaps make the second script not dependent on the USSR being in the war.

SeaLion is always a problem because the investment in invading the UK can often mean that the Axis have insufficient forces on the Eastern Front.

[VigaBrand]

Yes, but all in all, if he wins, because the axis strategy was bad, what should we change?
All works pretty well for me.

[dave123]

The problem is that the USA was not gaining mobilization even though England was in dire straits, Spain had went axis, and pearl harbor had been attacked. England very nearly fell, and was materially devastated. If he had managed to finish off England, and were it not for several mistakes, he would have, than the game would have been won with the USA never even seeing their mobilization going up.

A couple of more diplo hits on Russia,and England would have fallen, and all those heavily experienced Germans would have been transferred to the east. All while the USA just sat and watched.

[nnason]

In my game I had a successful Sealion but USA joined in early 1941. The added resources in England did not outweigh poor Barbarossa start and USA ramping up early.

[VigaBrand]

In dave123 game the Axis spend many MPP in diplo, so they get diplo hits on both SU and USA. This will delay the entrance of the USA/SU but it will cost much MPP and this is in the end death money for the axis.

[dave123]

Yeah, in the end, the money spent made it, although frustrating for the allies, a no win for the axis.

I still think that a successful invasion of England would have had more consequences for the Americans.