2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

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Chernobyl
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2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

Post by Chernobyl »

ElvisJJonesRambo wrote: Thu Dec 29, 2022 7:27 am Luxenberg, Netherlands, and Norway are averted by the Nazis, in order to delay the Yanks, exploit works.

Chinese did nothing, except die. Japs had great weather, Ilo4Tu played it by the book. Didn't even dish out a point of damage, let alone scratch a uniform of the yellow army.
As it is it makes very little sense to invade Netherlands and Luxembourg before USA is in the war. The Allies probably get more MPP out of it than Germany does, not to mention Axis gets to save a morale swing for the much more important fight against the USSR.

I think at the very least a quick partial fix would be to remove the diplo hit to USA mob for Germany taking these countries. Take away some of the incentive (Germany at least sacrifices some MPP production). Make it up by adding a USA mobilization increase for Fall of France (this was a decent "wakeup" moment that affected American public opinion that war might be coming).

I think China needs more defense. IRL The terrain and supply issues for Japan were substantial and Chinese counterattack abilities were real. In game, it's basically never smart for Chinese units to attack. Chinese units basically have to sit and take it, and a smart Japan player can methodically dismantle China for little cost.

Some of the Chinese generals could probably start with more experience considering they actually had quite a bit of modern warfare experience by 1939. General Xue was supposedly quite decent (won a few battles) so maybe give +1 to his command rating too?

Perhaps add more forts? I would probably place a couple destroyable forts in Communist Chinese hills near Yenan for starters. That area was tough to crack.

I would take a look at the three hexes in front of Changsha:
Change hex (191, 62) to Field (from Mountain). It still has a fort, but when Japanese troops march there, they won't be invulnerable. Historically this is roughly where Chinese troops did some damage to Japanese columns advancing on the low ground towards Changsha.
Enlarge the fort on hex (191, 63) to face the north and south also.
Change the Corps on hex (191, 63) into an Army. The Corps dies too easily even though it's in a fort, and Japan moves too quickly in the adjacent hexes to the south (ZOC slows it a bit).

Minor detail: I would also increase, the starting entrenchment levels of the Armies in front of Ichang (190, 61) from 3 to 4. Maybe even make it a fort? On some lucky starting turns as Japan I can severely damage this army (after destroying the other corps and army). It requires luck, but it's pretty devastating to China because they will have to withdraw from that hex, and Japan doesn't have to commit to it, just get lucky.
Moonchild
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Re: 2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

Post by Moonchild »

+1 to the above. (though I have limited experience in MP games...)
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Elessar2
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Re: 2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

Post by Elessar2 »

China could benefit from a LOT more partisan hexes. Far too many can be covered 2 or even 3 at a time by one garrison. Japan simply didn't have the manpower to garrrison the entire country in addition to their frontline units.
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IIo4Tu
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Re: 2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

Post by IIo4Tu »

China is normally out of balance at the moment, if it defends itself competently, then it will live long enough, or Japan will have to throw maximum forces at the expense of weakening expansion in other directions.
Japan is very limited in resources and the excesses in balancing China will lead to the fact that Japan will not be able to prepare for expansion in 1942.
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Bavre
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Re: 2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

Post by Bavre »

Chernobyl wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 1:47 am As it is it makes very little sense to invade Netherlands and Luxembourg before USA is in the war...
Just a tiny sidenote Chernobyl:

If you declare war on NL, Belgium will declare war on you the next turn. So 2 countries at the price of 1x aggro.
Also works in WiE.
Chernobyl
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Re: 2023 Thoughts on China German surrender hoarding

Post by Chernobyl »

Bavre wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 2:28 pm Just a tiny sidenote Chernobyl:
Ah good point, didn't know that.
IIo4Tu wrote: Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:04 am Japan is very limited in resources and the excesses in balancing China will lead to the fact that Japan will not be able to prepare for expansion in 1942.
This is partly true. Japan has a limited amount of MPP to play with that can either go to China or to Navy. The current situation actually isn't all that bad, and Japan should not be forced to commit to China. There's definitely a danger of swinging too far. I actually dislike the current solution of "punishing" Japan for being too successful in China. I think it should be slightly tougher to advance into the hilly area of China and the "penalty" of up to +15% USA mobilization should be removed.
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