ICARUS MOD Version 5 - Shri vs Wassmus

[shri]

First of all thanks to Michael @mdsmall for creating this great mod. I hope in the future some of it's great ideas be incorporated in the base game also.

Since, Michael has told me to give some constructive feedback in the form of an AAR, i have decided to do it, i will be posting (not regularly) from my CP (Shri) vs Entente (Wassmus) game. I am from India and Wassmus is from Germany, so there is a time difference in our play times as well. My opponent is someone i haven't played yet but seems like a strong player.

We are currently on turn 5 (the CP turn) and i know my chivalrous opponent won't be reading this till the game is over.

Summary of Turns 1 to 4 is as per the below post (i will post some screenshots 1/2 turns later)

[shri]

Dazo has discovered a great Schlieffen

Chernobyl and later OldCrow modified it.

Dazo and Michael also discovered the Montenegro gambit (which no longer works as before)

Fafnir once outlined on the forum in reply to some post as to how to take out Belgrade (again a must watch) for every CP player.

Anyway, i request readers of this AAR to go through these great posts. They outline why
1. Germany must always go WEST
2. How Schlieffen can be used

There are other great posts too, one of which is - Use the German Navy in 1914 or never use it ever. Do not attempt Jutland in 1916 but in 1914 as by 1916 the Royal navy is too strong by then and the German navy will just die a useless death without even scratching the surface.

Now, for a few updates about me as a player- My theory on WW1 is relatively strong, i have read Keegan as a school kid (still think he gave the best overall view), then later read Tuchmann (but found her too biased from my personal POV), read Norman stone and now Buttar on the eastern front, read up a bit on Gallipoli and Western front. Finally read Sleepwalkers (by Van Creweld, highly recommended all of his books esp the Logistics one) to understand how and why the War came about.

Having said that, i am an average player at-best, sometimes above average (in some games) but i do make elementary calculation mistakes from time to time even now. Despite nearly 400 hours clocked on the game and having participated in a couple of tournaments.

[shri]

Coming to round 1-

I went Schlieffen but knowing my own limitations didn't push as far ahead as Dazo suggests. I stopped at Reims and masked Brussels and captured Lille and the Belgian mines.

Also sent a German corps to occupy Krakow, posted 2 corps in the east to Guard the mines and Thorn (a strong attack on Thorn by Russia can - with luck, make it fall and make Germany lose lot of NM)

Meanwhile Austria attacked Serbia and tried to take Belgrade.
Despite practicing a few times, i didn't succeed, i destroyed the brigade but didn't occupy Belgrade (mis-steps by me).

Austria also decided to occupy the Oil fields with Cavalry in a sacrifice to delay the loss of NM due to loss of Galicia. 2-3 turns of saving it also makes a difference and losing cavalry (which can be re-purchased is maybe ok - time will tell if i am right)

Ottomans are still to come in so waiting for them.

Played some aggressive naval moves with my German navy fully expecting half of it to be lost.

[shri]

Round 2 (first Allied turn)
Major POW-WOW all over the Western front by my opponent.

First of all he rushed his cruisers in suicidal bravery and lost lots of steps (but no full units) and destroyed 2 of my DDs (which had laid mines) and damaged my subs.

Then he took out 1 corps of mine (which had helped take out 1 French corps in turn 1 and was a few points down)

Then he had the London and Paris regiments triggered and pushed them up (sacrificing them to gain time, great move on his part, mistake on my part to not anticipate this)

Obviously triggered the free French marines

In Serbia, at sizeable cost he occupied Belgrade with a full corps and killed my masking corps (the one which advances) losing 6-7 steps in the process. To be honest, i don't mind it as Serbia cannot afford too many losses.

In Galicia he damaged my cavalry badly and 1 corps badly. but other than Tarnopol nothing has fallen (till now)

P.S.: This cavalry got destroyed in the succeeding turn and the Galician oil fields fell on Turn 4 instead of Turn 2, gaining me an advantage of 1 turn only. The only advantage is for loss of 1 cavalry + 6 infantry steps i killed 2 Russian corps and a couple of more got minor damages killing my cavalry. So, temporarily (1-2 turn max) i may have gained some respite for the poor Austrians albeit at relatively high cost.

[shri]

There are several problems for a CP player which make the 1914 scenario so interesting and challenging-

1. Does one do a full Schlieffen or go East?
2. How far does one push in Schlieffen?
3. Does one get overextended and take the risk or wait around the Reims-Sedan-short of Amiens line (relatively stronger defenses and better supply) and attack Boulogne and finish the Belgians?
4. What does one do with the Navy?
5. What does one do with the Austrian navy or the Turkish navy?
6. Reinforce corps, purchase back units lost or attack and kill enemy risking a loss?
7. Push research or first push for saving the Dutch from Diplo attacks?
8. How does one defend as Ottomans?
9. How deep does one push into Serbia?
10. How far is retreat from Galicia feasible? This is even more so in ICARUS version, as fall of Lemberg can trigger a massive Romanian influence measure as per the notes i have read (i don't know exactly how much)

These and other Qs occupy the CP player's mind in 1914 and not all can be solved i guess.

[shri]

Situation in East Prussia - same in Turn 5 and Turn 7 of the CP.

[shri]

Situation on Lodz/Warsaw. The Germans have moved just near Warsaw and Novo-George on turn 7 but without reinforcements and artillery it is impossible to assault it now.

[shri]

CP risked their entire German navy and i was very scared of the 4 British BBs ganging up in attrition. Thankfully my opponent got a bit of chicken due to my hyper aggressive moves by the Navy, my navy escapes with a great many hits but only 2 DDs are knocked out (they will be sorely missed, yet losses could have been much much more)

The british have lost 1 BC and 2 old Pre Dread noughts. (they can afford it)
They also lost a lot of hit points on their suicidal cruisers who charged at 3 of my mines in repeated turns. But all escaped with 2-3 hit points. (they can afford this also)

[shri]

In Serbia, Belgrade still resists but the other town has fallen, Austria is slowly grinding up. 2 detachments and 1 Corps lost by Serbia for 1 Corps lost by Austria.
It is bad attritional warfare and not taking Belgrade is my bad mistake on the first turn (due to missteps in move or bad luck)

[shri]

In Galicia, the Russians take the Oil Well, Tarnopol, knock out 1 Cavalry, 1 Infantry, while losing 2 Infantry and several Infantry steps. They also try to take out my Detachment holding Czernowitz bravely (let's see till when it stands).
Right now Lemberg holds and if it holds 1 more turn Winter will save me till March and by then Germans should be coming in to help the Austrians.

[shri]

On the Western front i took my main attempts at killing troops, 3 Corps - 1 British and 2 French escaped inside with 1-2 hits left. But the Belgians are dead except for one detachment in Antwerp and the French have lost a few Corps. The British have lost 1 of the premier BEF corps (the other escaped with 1 step) and Amiens and Reims have fallen, Verdun is partially masked by me. (i hope to fully mask it and take it out ASAP).

But i too have lost units. It is hard attrition in Elsab-Lothringen.

P.S.: I decided pre match that conquering Paris is beyond the means of the German Army and my primary aim was killing the 2 BEF, the whole lot of Belgians, the French marines and at-least 5 French corps. Also occupying the Amiens-Reims line with Verdun fully masked. I haven't been successful despite my limited objectives.

The 2 free units - London Detachment and Paris Detachment have helped my opponent to guard points temporarily. Though i still feel abandoning Amiens so early in the game should cause some NM loss. It was a major Railway and Supply junction in the war.

[shri]

What i have learnt while writing this AAR so far -
1. My limited objectives war in the West is better than "offensive a la outrance"
2. I need to learn to take Belgrade (my nth learning attempt)
3. I need to learn to defend Galicia a bit better (i expected at-least one more turn before the Lemberg assaults started)
4. Naval game thrill was fun, probably the consensus of use it or lose it in 1914 is right (i used to use my navy like "Fleet in Being" earlier)
5. I need to find some better way to attack Russians in force than the stupid Ludendorff move on Lodz because my opponent simply refused to go toe-to-toe here and chose to just defend Warsaw and Novo-George, i couldn't use my superior German corps against his Russians to farm XP for units and HQ or decrease his NM.

[OldCrowBalthazor]

Great progress in the West. I always go west too...always
Can't wait to see more!

[shri]

Great progress in the West. I always go west too...always
Can't wait to see more!

As a far more experienced player, have you managed to capture Paris? I never managed ever except against that brain dead AI.

[shri]

Late October:
Germans lose 2 corps trying to secure the sole railway line to Verdun, French lose 1, further 2 French corps are badly hit but escape.

Overall 7 corps so far of my enemy have escaped destruction with 1-2 hits left. Bad play by me. [2 of these were Serbian corps, 1 was the English BEF corps which escaped with 1 hit point, the other had died properly; the other 4 are French corps].

My opponent (as per my Zeppelin Scout) has an army of 2 British and 3 French Corps waiting around Paris for a counter attack (though not all these corps are at full strength) + he has 2 cavalry corps of the French at low strength and dubious value.


Austria is in a total mess, Michael's notes say, Austria regains NM if Lemberg is retaken (old timers like Old Crow or any others who have played this mod, please help me here) or any other such NM lost city is retaken, but i lost like 7 NM on loss of NM and regained nothing so far. Germans have taken Lemberg back with their elite Corps and i hate to operate 3 German corps to Galicia to save Austrian downfall. Thus my attack planned on Warsaw is now indefinitely postponed till Artillery 1 level appears. I have 0 reserves left. Further had to send 1 German corps to Serbian front also. The Austrians are a total mess as usual, they keep losing 1 unit per turn, total 7 so far (including 1 detachment, 1 cavalry and 5 corps), unsustainable losses. One saving grace for Austria is they hit trench warfare level 1 and may survive the Winter with the help of Mackensen's Army which holds Lemberg and the frontlines with 3 corps.

Ottomans join the war and will promptly lose a lot of MPPs due to Typhus etc. For now i cannot do much with them.

The status as on Early October is as below in pics.

[mdsmall]

Hi shri - great to see that you are writing this AAR on your Icarus match against Wassmus! I look forward to hearing more about how it plays out, especially how either of you might use some of the new features in this mod. (They are less apparent in 1914 than later in the war and Entente side gets more new Decision Events than the Central Powers).

Here are a couple of my comments on points you have raised above.

Lemberg: Austria-Hungary loses 2500 NM points if the Russians take it, but in the Icarus mod, if they can retake it, they should win back 2500 NM points. I looked again at the settings for the mod and could see not glitches on this point. So double check the NM graphs under Reports to see if you see the curve going back up for A-H. There should also be a notification that would be recorded if you press L to see past notifications. Let me know if this definitely did not fire for you.

Romania: In the regular game and the 1914 Icarus campaign, Romania will swing 10-15% towards the Entente if the Russians capture Lemberg. However, in the Icarus mod, they should swing back towards the Central Powers by that much if the CP retakes Lemberg. It would be good to know if that happened. There is a much bigger swing by Romania towards the Entente if Russia takes several other NM objectives in Galicia but that is in the 1916 campaign only. You were probably thinking of that. I included this feature in the 1916 campaign to encourage the Entente to try to bring Romania into the war, as happened historically by late summer 1916.

Game-play: I always prefer executing a version of the Schlieffen plan when I play the Central Powers since that was the German grand strategy in 1914 and most of their armies are already deployed to carry that out. That said, an East-first opening is at least as effective in terms of winning the game. See past posts by Bavre and others on this forum. I would say that it is just about impossible for the CP to take Paris before they get artillery weapons 1 tech and several artillery units upgraded to that level. They simply can't concentrate enough fire-power on a well entrenched enemy in Paris. So the strategic question for the CP is whether to keep on hammering the French while waiting to get your artillery place, or to divert your attention to disrupting Russia in Poland and Galicia.

What is absolutely essential though is that the CP launch a concentrated drive into Serbia in 1914 or early 1915. You need to bring in the Bulgarians on your side and capture Nish, at least, by late 1915 in order to establish an overland convoy route to the Ottomans. In my experience playing both sides, if the CP can't achieve that the Ottomans die and then the Central Powers collapse. Taking Belgrade on the first turn - even with perfectly executed moves - is a 50-50 proposition. There is a good case for just moving the A-H armies adjacent to Belgrade on the first turn and launching a prepared attack on the second turn. Until you take Belgrade, the Bulgarians will not start to shift a few percent each turn towards the C.P. Note that you have to keep a CP unit on Belgrade at all times for this swing to occur.

Don't worry much about diplomacy pressure against Netherlands at this stage of the war. You can see if he is making diplomatic investments by reading the reports. You also start with a 25% buffer in your favour. It is more of a risk for you starting in late 1915, after the Entente have made all their key investments in tech and have bought all of the artillery they are allowed.

If you feel you can afford it, a couple of CP diplomatic chits at this stage of the war invested in Bulgaria can pay significant dividends if you are patient.

Good luck!

Michael

[shri]

//Lemberg: Austria-Hungary loses 2500 NM points if the Russians take it, but in the Icarus mod, if they can retake it, they should win back 2500 NM points. I looked again at the settings for the mod and could see not glitches on this point. So double check the NM graphs under Reports to see if you see the curve going back up for A-H. There should also be a notification that would be recorded if you press L to see past notifications. Let me know if this definitely did not fire for you.

Romania: In the regular game and the 1914 Icarus campaign, Romania will swing 10-15% towards the Entente if the Russians capture Lemberg. However, in the Icarus mod, they should swing back towards the Central Powers by that much if the CP retakes Lemberg. It would be good to know if that happened. There is a much bigger swing by Romania towards the Entente if Russia takes several other NM objectives in Galicia but that is in the 1916 campaign only. You were probably thinking of that. I included this feature in the 1916 campaign to encourage the Entente to try to bring Romania into the war, as happened historically by late summer 1916.//

Michael,
Both of these things did not happen, Romania hit 33% when Lemberg fell, when German corps retook Lemberg immediately, they stayed at 33% and stay there after a brutal turn (when Lemberg is still held by another German corps).

Also Austria did not regain 2500 NM, that is a lot of NM and i definitely would have noticed it's effects on the bar, this too didn't fire properly.

Please recheck both these events, thanks.

[shri]

//Game-play: I always prefer executing a version of the Schlieffen plan when I play the Central Powers since that was the German grand strategy in 1914 and most of their armies are already deployed to carry that out. That said, an East-first opening is at least as effective in terms of winning the game. See past posts by Bavre and others on this forum. I would say that it is just about impossible for the CP to take Paris before they get artillery weapons 1 tech and several artillery units upgraded to that level. They simply can't concentrate enough fire-power on a well entrenched enemy in Paris. So the strategic question for the CP is whether to keep on hammering the French while waiting to get your artillery place, or to divert your attention to disrupting Russia in Poland and Galicia.//..

Austria has collapsed in Galicia, losing 3 corps, 1 cavalry and 1 detachment, forcing me to divert Mackensen and 3 full German corps including an elite 11 strength one which currently occupies Lemberg. That forced me to stop my French offensive on the Amiens-Nancy line (though Nancy and Verdun are held by France.
I could not let Austria collapse so early.




//What is absolutely essential though is that the CP launch a concentrated drive into Serbia in 1914 or early 1915. You need to bring in the Bulgarians on your side and capture Nish, at least, by late 1915 in order to establish an overland convoy route to the Ottomans. In my experience playing both sides, if the CP can't achieve that the Ottomans die and then the Central Powers collapse. Taking Belgrade on the first turn - even with perfectly executed moves - is a 50-50 proposition. There is a good case for just moving the A-H armies adjacent to Belgrade on the first turn and launching a prepared attack on the second turn. Until you take Belgrade, the Bulgarians will not start to shift a few percent each turn towards the C.P. Note that you have to keep a CP unit on Belgrade at all times for this swing to occur.//

This is purely my blunder. I failed to take Belgrade now his corps is dug-in and i need level 1 artillery to take it.

[mdsmall]

//Lemberg: Austria-Hungary loses 2500 NM points if the Russians take it, but in the Icarus mod, if they can retake it, they should win back 2500 NM points....

Romania: In the regular game and the 1914 Icarus campaign, Romania will swing 10-15% towards the Entente if the Russians capture Lemberg. However, in the Icarus mod, they should swing back towards the Central Powers by that much if the CP retakes Lemberg.....

Michael,
Both of these things did not happen, Romania hit 33% when Lemberg fell, when German corps retook Lemberg immediately, they stayed at 33% and stay there after a brutal turn (when Lemberg is still held by another German corps).

Also Austria did not regain 2500 NM, that is a lot of NM and i definitely would have noticed it's effects on the bar, this too didn't fire properly.

Please recheck both these events, thanks.

Hi shri - After many hot test tests, I figured out the source of the glitch that you have reported. It has to do with whether the game engine is scripted to check if the enemy has captured a friendly NM objective hex at the beginning or the end of a friendly turn. I have corrected this glitch in Version 5 of the mod and have uploaded the corrected version to my dropbox. Anyone reading this who has an older version of the mod should download the version that has today's date, August 6, 2023.

That won't help your current game, but the problem should only occur if one side retakes an NM hex in the very next turn after it is captured. If you wait one full friendly turn before launching your counter-attack, the scripts should still fire correctly.

Many thanks for reporting this!

Michael

[shri]

//Lemberg: Austria-Hungary loses 2500 NM points if the Russians take it, but in the Icarus mod, if they can retake it, they should win back 2500 NM points....

Romania: In the regular game and the 1914 Icarus campaign, Romania will swing 10-15% towards the Entente if the Russians capture Lemberg. However, in the Icarus mod, they should swing back towards the Central Powers by that much if the CP retakes Lemberg.....

Michael,
Both of these things did not happen, Romania hit 33% when Lemberg fell, when German corps retook Lemberg immediately, they stayed at 33% and stay there after a brutal turn (when Lemberg is still held by another German corps).

Also Austria did not regain 2500 NM, that is a lot of NM and i definitely would have noticed it's effects on the bar, this too didn't fire properly.

Please recheck both these events, thanks.

Hi shri - After many hot test tests, I figured out the source of the glitch that you have reported. It has to do with whether the game engine is scripted to check if the enemy has captured a friendly NM objective hex at the beginning or the end of a friendly turn. I have corrected this glitch in Version 5 of the mod and have uploaded the corrected version to my dropbox. Anyone reading this who has an older version of the mod should download the version that has today's date, August 6, 2023.

That won't help your current game, but the problem should only occur if one side retakes an NM hex in the very next turn after it is captured. If you wait one full friendly turn before launching your counter-attack, the scripts should still fire correctly.

Many thanks for reporting this!

Michael

Micheal,

Many thanks for this. But i am loathe to restart my game now since we have already completed 1 full year of Combat and are in late July 1915.

But i will download the newer version before i begin my next game, wherein i want to test myself in the 1916 campaign which has your Stormtroopers and heavy artillery in full force.

Regards,
Shri.

P.S.: Mackensen disobeyed "defensive" orders and found a gap and exploited it before OberOst could give out commands. Auftragstaktik has it's 2 sides.