Are RPGs broken?

[Xmudder]

I just started a new game, and my RPG infantry are being crushed by light tanks and APCs. I am having to replace 1-2k troops a turn (losses as high as 2700 for 2-3 battles). In previous games this did not happen. Has something changed?

A recurring problem: The MRC never prompts to research new techs after the breakthrough. There were 10 techs to choose from when I checked, including combat armor and guided RPGs

[AnddyiRaynor]

If there is a hazard rating on your planet like incapacitation or instant death then they are more likely to die(all infantry types due to new changes during the last major patch?). If there are zero hazards then it might be a problem, they do seem less effective but my infantry have killed tanks without getting killed even without rpgs or apcs.

[Xmudder]

Zero hazards, but I am having an ammo problem. My units go from being supplied to black (no ammo) even when the units are nowhere near the front or did not fight that turn. Most of my hexes are linked by rail, and are usually green in the "bottlenecks" mapmode.

I'm using 8 inf / 2 mg / 2 rpg (10 brigades) and even 4k ammo a turn isn't keeping up.

[Voker57]

RPGs are fine, just get enough ammo if you lack it.

[Soar_Slitherine]

Low-tech RPGs are weak - in open terrain, they need 3 or so weapon or armor techs to hold up decently against even 50mm steel armor light tanks. Tanks do not get as many tech upgrades, so the relative power of RPGs increases as the game goes on. In open terrain or against large-scale attacks, they also need to be massed in order to be effective, 200 RPGs per battalion does not necessarily cut it. Of course, they do need to have ammo as well in order to be effective.

Zero hazards, but I am having an ammo problem. ... Most of my hexes are linked by rail, and are usually green in the "bottlenecks" mapmode.

I'm using 8 inf / 2 mg / 2 rpg (10 brigades) and even 4k ammo a turn isn't keeping up.

If you're not seeing any bottlenecks, then you need to produce more ammo. Investing in the newly added ammo factories, instead of relying on workshop production, will save a lot in IP in the long term. On the right side of the top bar, you can check Stats -> Logistical -> Unit Ammo Supply to see how much ammo your units are missing.

This is a recent balance change - everything uses way more ammo since the latest major patch, especially tank & artillery guns. There is a new tech that can give howitzer guns more soft attack in the lategame and micro-nuke RPGs got a firepower nerf, but other than that, and the extra kill chance from enviromental hazards on some planets (which favors thicker armor), the balance of vehicles vs RPGs has only changed in terms of ammo use (to the advantage of RPGs overall, though AFAIK, since the AI ignores logistics points limitations, it doesn't have the same limitations as players regarding how many attacking tanks its logistics can feed at the same time).

[Xmudder]

Thanks, the stats -> logistics -> Ammo gave me the overview I needed. I am building ammo plants as fast as I can, but I have a metal shortage / bottleneck. 500 metal for 5000 ammo/turn, or 500 metal for 2 turns to build a factory producing 1500/turn.

[AnddyiRaynor]

Because 450 a turn gives you 13500 not to mention techs that double or triple that. The 6000(200 metal) one is giving me 21000 a turn with 180% tech bonus +25% relations bonus and I don't even have the ammo printer( I do have industry industrialization + state companies +40%.

[Xmudder]

I'm still getting slaughtered vs the AI major despite technological parity and fixing my ammo shortage and I have no idea why. This includes losing defensive infantry vs infantry combat at a 5:1 loss ratio, and the projected combat odds on attack having nothing to do with the actual combat losses or victory. I'm pretty sure it is the last beta patch that did this, but I do not know what will happen if I revert to the base game and reload to see if things are different.

[Xmudder]

Low-tech RPGs are weak - in open terrain, they need 3 or so weapon or armor techs to hold up decently against even 50mm steel armor light tanks. Tanks do not get as many tech upgrades, so the relative power of RPGs increases as the game goes on. In open terrain or against large-scale attacks, they also need to be massed in order to be effective, 200 RPGs per battalion does not necessarily cut it. Of course, they do need to have ammo as well in order to be effective.

If I am reading this correctly, I should have switched all my battalions to heavy RPG battalions (4/4) instead of my more balanced 6/2/2 custom battalions when the war began, and I should have researched guided RPGs before combat armor.

[Soar_Slitherine]

I'm pretty sure it is the last beta patch that did this, but I do not know what will happen if I revert to the base game and reload to see if things are different.

Newer savegames do not work properly in older versions.

If I am reading this correctly, I should have switched all my battalions to heavy RPG battalions (4/4) instead of my more balanced 6/2/2 custom battalions when the war began, and I should have researched guided RPGs before combat armor.

RPGs benefit from both weapon and armor tech. More RPGs may help if enemy tanks are what's doing the slaughtering, but if you're losing defensive combat horribly against infantry, you have other problems.

Recent versions include combat reports for defensive battles, which you can find in HIS -> Report. These include a summary of the most important modifiers that applied in the combat, and unlike the combat odds screen, they aren't just from a simulation, so they fully correspond to what happened in the actual combat. If it's available in your savegame, you should be able to see there why your defenders are getting their asses kicked.

If the problem is that the enemy has superior models rather than superior modifiers, that won't show up there, but you did say that you have technological parity.

[Uemon]

They are not broken they are just... kinda useless. Well not exactly. They are a quick and cheap way of getting hard attack against certain enemies. Like minor AI spiders minor AI with guardians. They will slaughter those, compared to normal infantry who will struggle without gauss rifles and combat armor.

But they are not counter to actual tanks. Even light tanks will just bully them away and usually inflict catastrophic casualties.

If you want a counter for armor, you really need anti tank guns or armor with high velocity guns.