Dysfunctional 160mm Stielgranate

[Wiedrock]

Stielgranate_HEAT issue_combat0.jpg (244.95 KiB) Viewed 680 times

Similar to the issue with the Rifle Greandes. The Gun is supposed to be an UPGRADE to the 37mm Pak. But since it only has HEAT, the Soft damage gets basically negated and the HEAT (since it is HEAT which only gets "rolled occasionally", as HVAP only gets "rolled occasionally" the whole gun isn't working.
And 50ACC, like..... "SPLIT UP KAMERADEN, EVERYONE A STIELGRENADE AT HAND AND CHARGE THE TANK!"

Stielgranate_HEAT issue.jpg (186.1 KiB) Viewed 680 times

Generally. There is no reason for this whole separate "gun". It's just a 37mm with a different type of Ammo put on the tip of the gun. What it should be is a normal 37mm with added HEAT value....yes occasionally it would make a 800m hit with it (out of 1000shots - when HEAT gets "rolled" and it actually hits), but this would still be more realistic than this.
DON'T ASK HOW IT PERFORMS WHEN 'ATTACK IS HALTED' AT 100YARDS!!!
Following another example, the guns in Question are still Vanilla, but the Soviets attack with massive stacked Units.

Stielgranate_HEAT issue_combat1.jpg (233.66 KiB) Viewed 680 times

Following: Just to show an example (not intended to show an supposed fix!) on how it behaves differently when the HEAT becomes Anti-Armor (note that AT-Guns are programmed to use the "pen" value).

Stielgranate_HEAT issue_combat2_changedHEAT.jpg (249.94 KiB) Viewed 680 times

But those battles also nicely show that on the defense you should rather take Pak-Battalions over some AFV-Battalion because AFVs have lower RoF and have like 8xDEStroyed rates (if attacker has good AP) which makes them just equal to Pak.
Someone should have told Germans that you'd better build more Pak then building all those AFVs in 44/45 on the defence.

[Denniss]

Pavel, our main programmer, wants to have a look at this. Do you happen to have a scenario/save set up for easy replication? Test objects should be Stielgranate, Rifle Grenade, possibly lefh18 and italian 105mm M13 field gun. The latter two for possible AP ammo selection if combat range is low and target is armored. The former two should probably be in vanilla and modified form to show difference.

[Wiedrock]

Pavel, our main programmer, wants to have a look at this. Do you happen to have a scenario/save set up for easy replication? Test objects should be Stielgranate, Rifle Grenade, possibly lefh18 and italian 105mm M13 field gun. The latter two for possible AP ammo selection if combat range is low and target is armored. The former two should probably be in vanilla and modified form to show difference.

Hope it got all you need.

VtB HEAT.rar

(2.08 MiB) Downloaded 13 times

The ones with the ending "2" have the edited Devices (HEAT values into Anti-Armor). I also added Rifle Grenade only Squads, since there the missing Soft Damage can be seen at a glance.
I have also added different kinds of "Gun Types". Since the use of "AT" Ammo varies (also between tests).
I think it is mostly AT (obv.) and after that Infantry Guns ususally hitting AP. While I think it would make sense to also have Light Artillery (having a shorter distance to the frontline) to also be more able to take AP shots. (not suggesting that too little tanks get killed in the game by pointing this out)

[Wiedrock]

Some consumption numbers for a Pz.Div.

3,7 cm Stielgranate 41 (315 rounds fired between November 1942 and July 1943)

It also lists authorized Loadouts for 1944 where the Stielgranate was not present anymore.

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Generally. There is no reason for this whole separate "gun". It's just a 37mm with a different type of Ammo put on the tip of the gun. What it should be is a normal 37mm with added HEAT value.

Did not find authorized exact loadouts. The manual states:

[...]

Instructions for the 3.7 cm Stielgranate 41 and 3.7 cm Stielgranate 41 (Üb) of the 3.7 cm Pak

III. Loading the 3.7 cm Stielgr. 41

6. The 3.7 cm Stielgr. 41, ready for use according to No. 5, must be inserted into the muzzle with its stem. The stem must slide easily into the gun barrel until the base of the fin plate audibly stops against the muzzle. For removing the fuze cap, see No. 1.

7. The cartridge case of the 3.7 cm Stielgr. 41 must always be inserted after the projectile has been mounted. It is marked on the base with "Stiel-Gr" in white lettering.

Caution!

Instead of the cartridge case

do not insert live ammunition! Otherwise, the barrel will burst!

8. After mounting the projectile, the loader must take cover behind the gun. Otherwise, internal injuries due to the high muzzle gas pressure are possible.

9. Before switching to firing cartridge ammunition, the tube should be swished once with the wiper to remove any metal particles or other contaminants that may have come loose from the casings.

[...]