Surrounded Units

Toby42 · Post by **Toby42** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:56 am

I have a Glider unit of the 101st surrounded in Bastogne. It is a four step unit. I have attacked at 10 to 1 odds for five turns. Each time I knock off a step. Somehow it keeps receiving replacements. Is this right??? I'm not sure this should happen with a surrounded unit. If this is the case I can never capture the town.

e_barkmann · Post by **e_barkmann** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 8:45 am

Treale wrote:I have a Glider unit of the 101st surrounded in Bastogne. It is a four step unit. I have attacked at 10 to 1 odds for five turns. Each time I knock off a step. Somehow it keeps receiving replacements. Is this right??? I'm not sure this should happen with a surrounded unit. If this is the case I can never capture the town.

In TAO3 Bastogne is a supply centre, meaning that units can hold out indefinitely if not attacked in the right way.

You need to do multiple attacks on the hex, so you can try and knock out more than 1 step per turn, thus winning the attrition race.

Cheers Chris

Rob Gjessing · Post by **Rob Gjessing** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:18 am

Or another way is to retreat one of your stacks, so that there is a vacant hex for the enemy to retreat into and then try and attack at 10-1 odds and you may get a R result.. forcing the pesky little unit(s) out of Bastogne and then more easily killed.

Someone did that to me in a PBEM game.. I was not happy at all! I think it was Nickel!

LarkinVB · Post by **LarkinVB** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 1:07 pm

Sounds like a small problem with the game engine when a unit is defeated by giving it room to retreat instead of surrounding it completlely. At least it doesn't sound very realistic.

Rob Gjessing · Post by **Rob Gjessing** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 2:37 pm

When a unit is surrounded and it receives a Retreat result there is a chance that it will take additional losses. You need to know that. So the engine is realistic in the sense that if a unit is surrounded it will take additional loses, or prisoners - if it would prefer to flee from battle but is unable to.

In terms of adopting a strategy to create room for a unit to retreat in to, I dont know if thats a flaw in the system, units did rout in battle and try to flee.. often even given up good defensive terrain in the face of a strong attacker. A retreat result from combat is excatly that.. the unit routing.. I dont see how that us not realistic.. if anything I think it is realistic.. and it did happen in real life..

There is more then 1 way to skin a cat.

Toby42 · Post by **Toby42** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 5:10 am

Chris Merchant wrote:In TAO3 Bastogne is a supply centre, meaning that units can hold out indefinitely if not attacked in the right way.

You need to do multiple attacks on the hex, so you can try and knock out more than 1 step per turn, thus winning the attrition race.

Cheers Chris

I can understand the Supply Center, but the lost steps being replaced is another thing. You can only drag the "Cooks" to the frontline only once. I think that the same issue is in the KP Campaign Game. The surrounded Soviet units can receive replacements.

Rob Gjessing · Post by **Rob Gjessing** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 11:42 am

I do tend to agree that you can not continually replace men in a situation where they are surrounded.

But, losing a step isnt always about men dying, a lost step can reflect a loss in combat effectiveness - the unit being rattled or disorganised for example.

But like I said.. I do see your point.

Toby42 · Post by **Toby42** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 4:03 am

Rob Gjessing wrote:I do tend to agree that you can not continually replace men in a situation where they are surrounded.

But, losing a step isnt always about men dying, a lost step can reflect a loss in combat effectiveness - the unit being rattled or disorganised for example.

But like I said.. I do see your point.

I guess it has to be this way to try and duplicate the real siege. If it was too easy to take Bastogne (or any fortified city), it would probably un-balance the game. I think that you can take Bastogne if the Germans committ all of their offensive power against it. Which is what they did in the battle.

"Great Game" anyway. They just need to improve the graphics. Hard to make out roads, bridges, etc.

Fred98 · Post by **Fred98** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:04 am

Treale wrote:I ....They just need to improve the graphics. Hard to make out roads, bridges, etc.

This will be amended in the upcoming patch