Questions from the stands

[Popeye USN]

Playing my first PBEM game. #17 and I'm the IJN. I've got a "few" questions for the experts:
1. I'm getting killed by USN subs. How to you protect your ports? PC's? DD's? And, how do you keep them in the same port hex?
2. How do you develop an ASW TF?
3. Manual says 15 ships to a TF. True? If you put, say 7 CV's in a TF, that's only 8 AA ships in support? I have been putting max---25 to a TF.
4. Did the IJN ever develop ship's RADAR?
5. CS. Mission? Best use?
6. Best use for AV's?
7. Subs. Mines or Patrol? Best use?
8. I'd like to put a bounty on coastwatchers! Can you get rid of them?
9. BBTF. When in Bombarment mode they always seem to complete the orders, but head for home afterwards? Scared or just need some liberty?
10. After taking Guadalcanal, my plan is to take PM. Best to go slow by taking Buna and Gili Gili, or straight for the throat?
11. Lastly, (Thank God you say!) As of 1993 CVBG transit doctrine was:
A. SSN's first to take out enemy SSN's and gather targeting data
B. DD's forward with tails to sprint and drift for SSN detection
C. CG's & DDG's SAM & Surface to Surface missile shooters on the
threat bearing
D. CVBG
E. Replenishment TF in trail
Question? Reading AAR's no one seems to have subs lead the way for any invasion or CVTF transit? To hard, or not worth it?
In advance....thank you! [&o]

[Buckeye5]

[quote]ORIGINAL: Popeye USN

Playing my first PBEM game. #17 and I'm the IJN. I've got a "few" questions for the experts:
1. I'm getting killed by USN subs. How to you protect your ports? PC's? DD's? And, how do you keep them in the same port hex?

* As the IJN, you're at a disadvantage in ASW, but you're not helpless. Put seaplanes (the shorter-ranged ones) on ASW patrol at 2-5k feet. They may not actually hit the subs, but if they spot them it greatly reduces the likelihood of an attack. Your other option is to put LOTS of ASW-capable vessels in a surface combat task force, set them to Patrol/Do Not Retire, and hope one of them gets lucky.

2. How do you develop an ASW TF?

* See #1. Create a surface combat TF, assign it "Patrol/Do Not Retire", and cram it full of ASW-capable ships. If you're in a port hex, you may need to go back to the TF every day and order it to undock.

3. Manual says 15 ships to a TF. True? If you put, say 7 CV's in a TF, that's only 8 AA ships in support? I have been putting max---25 to a TF.

* I have better luck putting no more than 3 CVs in a task force, but creating multiple task forces and ordering one to follow the other. This lets you provide better AA coverage to the carriers, and gives multiple targets for an opponent to have to pick from.

4. Did the IJN ever develop ship's RADAR?

* I believe they do later in the game, for some of the CLs and DDs, but I'm not 100% sure.

5. CS. Mission? Best use?

* Use one or more to supplement a CV task force. Use the float planes for Naval Search/ASW duties, freeing up your attack planes for strike missions.

6. Best use for AV's?

* For the U.S....well, they make very nice fast transport ships. You can park them at a base where you don't have any aviation support and then use the AV's support to fly float planes out of the base, but I have yet to get any use from this ability. For the IJN (where the AVs usually have some planes of their own) put them at forward bases to provide some scout or ASW capability. Or drop the planes at the nearest base and use them as fast transports.

7. Subs. Mines or Patrol? Best use?

* IMHO, while I like the idea of using subs for mining, they're not very good at it--they just don't carry enough mines to create a nice, big field. Also, since you can only load mines at Truk, Brisbane, or Noumea, in can take a LOOOOONNNNNG time to place lots of mines with subs. I usually stick 1 or 2 on mining duty at the start of the game, then switch them to Patrol missions after they've dropped the field. The bulk of my subs spend all of their time on Patrol missions, though.

8. I'd like to put a bounty on coastwatchers! Can you get rid of them?

* It'd be nice, but no, you can't.

9. BBTF. When in Bombarment mode they always seem to complete the orders, but head for home afterwards? Scared or just need some liberty?

* Bombardment task forces, when created, are automatically assigned "Retirement Allowed" orders. They'll position themselves one sprint move from the target, zip in and bombard at night, and then zip out so as to be as far as possible from hostile air power when dawn comes. If you want them to stay on station, you have to manually change them to "Patrol/Do Not Retire" orders, and I'm not 100% sure you can do this with a bombardment task force.

10. After taking Guadalcanal, my plan is to take PM. Best to go slow by taking Buna and Gili Gili, or straight for the throat?

* As long as Buna and Gili Gili don't actually have troops, it's probably safe to bypass them. But it's so easy to take them (just FT in a single SNLF or Naval Garrison Unit--you can even come back and pick them up later), you should probably do it anyway.

11. Lastly, (Thank God you say!) As of 1993 CVBG transit doctrine was:
A. SSN's first to take out enemy SSN's and gather targeting data
B. DD's forward with tails to sprint and drift for SSN detection
C. CG's & DDG's SAM & Surface to Surface missile shooters on the
threat bearing
D. CVBG
E. Replenishment TF in trail
Question? Reading AAR's no one seems to have subs lead the way for any invasion or CVTF transit? To hard, or not worth it?
In advance....thank you!

* I don't usually have subs leading the way for my CV or invasion task forces. There are a couple of reasons. First, if you don't have a pretty good idea (from aerial recon) where the main enemy task forces are, should shouldn't be sending out that CV or invasion task force in the first place. Second, in modern naval warfare, one of the primary roles for submarines is to hunt enemy subs (or screen carrier groups against them). In UV, they subs don't really hunt other subs, which gives one less reason to use subs to screen other TFs. Finally, I usually use my subs for long-range patrols in areas where I know there's a high concentration of enemy merchant shipping. I think this is a more efficient use of them than sweeping forward in front of a surface task force.

Hope this helps a bit--bear in mind, I'm not exactly one of the old-timers around here.

[Popeye USN]

Thank you...helped a lot.

[DoomedMantis]

Some very good points

Some further tips, set your float planes to 50% ASW and at 1000 ft and they will attack subs more often and not be too affected by fatigue and Op losses. I tend to have about 30% of my floats on Naval Search and the rest on ASW patrol.

Bombardments on Do not retire will stay at the base, but there run in will be affected. Only use this if the airbase is already effectively closed.

Some of the Jap CL's and DD's have type 13 and type 22 radars. Try to spread them around your TF's.

[spence]

IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER SOME THOUGHTS

1. Buna is certainly worth taking especially if it's not garrisoned. It starts as a level 1 airbase so if you get some engineers there and a bit of supply you can build it up to a 2 fairly quickly and then have a bit of LRCAP for the PM invasion fleet without using any of your Zeros off the carriers.

2. If you use the multiple CV TF suggestion (one TF following another) make sure the slowest CV TF is the one that is followed. Otherwise you'll end up with the TFs in different hexes and you'll lose the benefit of having their combined CAPs to resist enemy airstrikes. Also if weather figures into a CV battle you could end up with only one of your CV TFs engaging while the other sits it out under a cloud. Good way to lose the numerical advantage the IJN enjoys early on.

3. Bombardment TFs that repeat their mission end up with no ammo. A BB without ammo in a surface fight is just a lot of VPs waiting to be lost.

4. Japanese ASW capabilities just plain stink and seem to get worse as time goes by - and that's just the way it is. It gets worse when the Americans remember to put "real" torpedos on their fleet boats.

5. Don't mine the beaches/ports you plan to land on. The various passages through the barrier reef along the coast of Oz are a good targets. When a sub sails from Truk load it with mines and then set it's homeport to Rabaul or Shortlands. After it's "maiden voyage" replenish with torpedos, send on patrol and forget about mining unless you pull it back to Truk for repair. Use the lower endurance MLs you get to set up extensive minefields at all bases you plan to build up. The Tsugaru and other high endurance MLs can lay some nice minefields in the enemy's back yard early in the game. Another nice area for these fields is amongst all the little islands over by Luganville/Efate. Tell you why in a sec.

6. While your buildup around Guadalcanal goes on watch out for CV raids originating out of the N/NNE. Seems like even with lots of planes on search missions that area is too wide open for anyone to count on spotting the approach of an enemy raiding force although the USN seems to have a slight advantage especially if they've installed a seaplane base N of Luganville. As the USN I pulled off 2 out of 3 raids on shipping around Lunga/Tulagi with multiple CV TFs in a single game. One sortie got spotted so I aborted the raid but the first thing my opponent knew about the other two was that it was raining bombs. A whole bunch of IJN cruisers and BBs were put out of action along with many AP types. An added benefit was that his Nells at Lunga came out to play during the withdrawal, ran into a CAP of 75 F4Fs and got slaughtered to no good purpose (Of course the computer launched 50 Zeros escorting half a dozen Nells (which fell to flak) and then launched 6 Zeros escorting 30 Nells most of which were shot down (the few survivors aborting before actually attacking the ships). Well anyway the approach route that seems to work for these raids is N out of Noumea hugging the East edge of the map for about 20 hexes then NNW for another 20 then NW for a day then basically due South to launch point. Back to MLs: single high endurance MLs can pull a reverse of this route into the area SE of Efate, put down a nice big minefield that may ruin somebody's day as they set forth on one of these raids. Seems the big boys: CVs/BBs have a penchant for hitting mines. Even if the minefield is discovered and swept you'll have an idea what's going through your opponents mind and a warning which might allow you to clear shipping out of the way or set up an ambush with your own CVs.

[AmiralLaurent]

1. I'm getting killed by USN subs. How to you protect your ports? PC's? DD's? And, how do you keep them in the same port hex?
2. How do you develop an ASW TF?

You can use planes but warining: the worst pilots in the squadron will fly ASW patrols and they have less chance to see and attack if their exp is bad. So choose a squadron where the worst pilots are over 60 to have a chance to do something. It's better to fly naval search as pilots with all ranges of exp will fly and high-exp pilots may attack subs.
As for creating ASW TF, pick up ships with Type 95 (and in 1943 Type 2) depth charges, they are far more efficient (more probability fo hit and far more probability to sink the sub if they hit). Then two tactics:
_ you can send them with retire orders to patrol known subs ambush areas
_ or you can send them to a given spot with "patrol/do not retire" orders.
To defend ports, you should have your ASW TF homeport put to another base. If you want to patrol Rabaul, set the homebase to Kavieng. If the home base is Rabaul the TF will dock every day and not patrol off the port and has no chance to see something.
_ anotehr tactic is to have a 1000-ton AP and many ASW ships in a patrolling TF. The sub may try to attack the AP rather than the ASW ships and has more chance to be seen before launching.

3. Manual says 15 ships to a TF. True? If you put, say 7 CV's in a TF, that's only 8 AA ships in support? I have been putting max---25 to a TF.

If a TF has more than 15 ships, AA and ASW coordination are reduced. It's probably better to have two CV TF if you have more than 6 CV, each with 6 CV. But you can also have 25 ships in a TF if you want, the risk taken is not so big, and at least you will not forget to change the orders of all your CV TFs...

4. Did the IJN ever develop ship's RADAR?

Yes Yugumo DD and Tama CL have it. IJN never upgrade in UV so don't except radar on CV or BB. I have never seen Japanese radar "work" anyway, the message is still "Japanese lookouts...". But the general advice is to put a radar equiped in each of your TF if you have some.

5. CS. Mission? Best use?

Useful for flying naval search. Use only Jakes and Alfs. Those planes are also useful to fly recon over enemy bases, so Vals and Kates are still with naval attack orders (or anything you want). After a successfull battle, you may give floatplanes naval attack orders, they may sink a transport or cripples. Put the planes at low alt to be successfull.

6. Best use for AV's?

In a port of size 3+, they will supply 12 points of avaiation support to seaplanes and floaplanes. Useless at sea and not a good idea to use them in a smaller port as coastwatchers will report them and Allied subs will come to sink them.

7. Subs. Mines or Patrol? Best use?

The subs I-121, 122, 123 are minelayers (load of 42 mines) and should be used for minelaying only. Other subs are far more useful with torpedoes. IJN subs losses are severe when you try to engage the USN main force or big invasion fleets late in 1942, and worse in 1943, but there may then still be successfull in rear area, if convoys have few escorts, or to chase cripples after battles.

8. I'd like to put a bounty on coastwatchers! Can you get rid of them?

No

9. BBTF. When in Bombarment mode they always seem to complete the orders, but head for home afterwards? Scared or just need some liberty?

After a bombardment, these TF become 'surface combat TF' with standard orders: retire. There is no way to change that but you can give them orders to follow another TF that will remain in the same hex. As someone said, take care of the ammo level of the bombardment TF, I never do more than two bombardment runs with any TF. And I only do the second if I know few enemy ships are in the area.

10. After taking Guadalcanal, my plan is to take PM. Best to go slow by taking Buna and Gili Gili, or straight for the throat?

Before taking PM, it's a good idea to take Lea Lea and Buna, so there is no retreat way for Allied troops and they will surrender. And Gili GIli is a useful place to dock damaged ships, especially is Allied subs are defending the straits just east of it.
If the places are undefended, take it with a small TF and parts of naval garnison units at the same time as your invasion. If they are defended, sail directly to PM and take it, then you will easily roundup the small bases around.

11. Lastly, (Thank God you say!) As of 1993 CVBG transit doctrine was:
A. SSN's first to take out enemy SSN's and gather targeting data
B. DD's forward with tails to sprint and drift for SSN detection
C. CG's & DDG's SAM & Surface to Surface missile shooters on the
threat bearing
D. CVBG
E. Replenishment TF in trail
Question? Reading AAR's no one seems to have subs lead the way for any invasion or CVTF transit? To hard, or not worth it?
In advance....thank you! [&o]

UV can't attack or even report enemy subs in UV. Sending surface DD TF before sailing could be a good idea. A surface TF with retire orders may report and even damage/sink an enemy sub that will attack your convoys or CV.
The best use for subs is to send them before your invasion fleet and have them patrol off enemy ports (not in the port hex but on the paths to the invasion area), to see if ships are sailing there and maybe attack them. It's also useful to have some SS at around 15 hexs of you main forces, ready to chase enemy cripples of a CV battle.

[Popeye USN]

Thank you!