Best infantry firearms of WWI

[oi_you_nutter]

as a way to generate some forum traffic while we wait for the game

my choices for best infantry firearms are:

the best infantry rife has to be the SMLE
the best light MG must be the Lewis gun
the best (and only) SMG the Bergman MP18
and for pistol the Colt M1911 Automatic

the worst weapon has to be the Chauchat French lmg

[Dirtdog20]

Ok for the sake of conversation,

For best Infantry Rifle: The fellow who was quicker on the trigger. Personally it is the 03 Springfield for me.

If you dont mind though I will also throw out the BAR since the plans were initially to issue one to every rifleman and Marine in the AEF.

Best LMG : Agree with you on Lewis. The Marines begged to carry the ones they were using in Haiti and the DR to France with them.

Best SMG: I wont argue with you about the Bergman.

Best Pistol: Again agree on the Colt Automatic.

Worst weapon is: Cho-Cho recambered for the American 7.62 service round. Conversion from standard to Metric was botced by the French at the factory, and made an already tempermental weapon even more touchy.

[wodin]

I would go for

1.Either the Lee Enfield or Springfield.

2.Lewis

3.MP18

4.Colt 1911

Worse weapon the Ross rifle

[oi_you_nutter]

ORIGINAL: Dirtdog20

Ok for the sake of conversation,

For best Infantry Rifle: The fellow who was quicker on the trigger. Personally it is the 03 Springfield for me.

If you dont mind though I will also throw out the BAR since the plans were initially to issue one to every rifleman and Marine in the AEF.

Best LMG : Agree with you on Lewis. The Marines begged to carry the ones they were using in Haiti and the DR to France with them.

Best SMG: I wont argue with you about the Bergman.

Best Pistol: Again agree on the Colt Automatic.

Worst weapon is: Cho-Cho recambered for the American 7.62 service round. Conversion from standard to Metric was botced by the French at the factory, and made an already tempermental weapon even more touchy.

After using the Lee Enfield in the Army Cadets, I am a little baised in saying that the 10 round magazine and the quicker bolt action would make it my choice over the others [:D]

The Lee Enfield as used by the original BEF in the first battle of Mons has to be an example of how good marksman training and good equipment can produce extraordinary results. The Germans thought that they had light machine guns.

Having 7.62 rechamering problems on the chauchaut added insult to injury for the AEF, especialy when the Lewis and the BAR were american designed weapons. Another example of bad descisions costing the lives of the common soldier.

[Dirtdog20]

The Lewis guns were all being used on aircraft production. Hence the decision to use the Cho-Cho until all the riflemen could be re-equiped with the BAR.

When the Germans first ran into the Marines they thought the Marines were carrying machineguns. So I completely agree with you about the value of marksmanship training.

Also the size of the American round forced a redesign of the magazine of the Cho-Cho. The primary differance being that more space was opened for dirt to enter the magazine and hence the action of the Cho-Cho.

[oi_you_nutter]

IIRC the cho-cho had a number of problems, a banana shaped mag with open slots that just begged to get clogged with dirt along with poor manufacturing tolerances / materials that did not help maintenance

probably a text book example of how not to design a military firearm

[Dirtdog20]

All in all considering the period the Cho-Cho in French service was not a bad weapon. As long as the Gunner and his A gunner did the proper soldier thing and kept the weapon clean, Ie; field service clean. Then it had a reputation as a reliable if not ideal weapon. Granted it had some contemporaries, Lewis, that were head and sholders better. However when you consider the situation France was in at the time of need, and that it's industrial base for the most part lie behind German lines, it is about as good a weapon as you could produce in those circumstances and times.

It is the "American" Cho-Cho's that gave the auto rifle it's reputation. But even with the faults of the weapon the AEF found that if you kept it field clean and didnt try to use it like a garden hose it was a ,(barely), serviceable weapon.

I have read in a Marines memoirs that they were bartering anything they could to get hold of Lewis guns once they arrived in France. It was also standard practice to take "possession" of unattended Lewis guns in garrison to guard them;) Then there was the time that the Marines were relieved by an Army National Guard Division and the relief was stopped because the Marines were making sure all the BAR's were properly guarded that belonged to the Army division

[wodin]

Very good memior by an American soldier.

A Youth in the Meuse-Argonne: A Memoir, 1917-1918
William S. Triplet, Robert H. Ferrell


And a great book on the Marines

Devil Dogs: Fighting Marines of World War I
George B. Clark

[wodin]

Dirtdog you can buy the poster in your avator for £250.00 at Naval and Military!

[Tankerace]

For rifle, I'd say either '03 Springfield, or '17 Enfield. I'm actually considering puchasing both.

Spingfield is ok, but after all, Sgt. York's weapon was the M1917 Enfield, not the 1903 Springfield.

SMLE isn't bad either.

[Dirtdog20]

There are a couple of other things I would like to get related to WWI before I buy the posters Wodin. Hopefully I can have my Doughboy uniform completed in time for the fall tactical at the Ceasar Krause Memorial site in November.

Besides I am still looking for that rare memoir I mentioned above that is still running around $10,000 US for a copy.[X(]

[Big B]

ORIGINAL: Dirtdog20

All in all considering the period the Cho-Cho in French service was not a bad weapon. As long as the Gunner and his A gunner did the proper soldier thing and kept the weapon clean, Ie; field service clean. ...snip

Hello all,
From what I have read (and none of us were actually there) the French Chauchat was actually a decent weapon. As Dirtdog20 points out it was the American versions that gave the most trouble because of incorrect tolerances in manufacturing...which wasn't discovered until relatively recently I believe.

On the positive side of the Chauchat, the Central powers had nothing like it(at least in mass production), and had to drag their Maxim's around like LMGs. Yuck!

Best Rifle: '03 Springfield, beyond doubt (I am an American afterall!).
Rest of the list - ditto

[Big B]

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

For rifle, I'd say either '03 Springfield, or '17 Enfield. I'm actually considering puchasing both.

Spingfield is ok, but after all, Sgt. York's weapon was the M1917 Enfield, not the 1903 Springfield.

SMLE isn't bad either.

Appearantly most American divisions landing in France in summer 1918 carried M1917s instead of the '03s the first divisions brought to France in 1917 - manufacturing issue I guess.
I own a well cared for '03. Buy one, you won't be disappointed.

[Big B]

ORIGINAL: Dirtdog20

Snip...

Worst weapon is: Cho-Cho recambered for the American 7.62 service round....

(Just for fun..)
Known here for the last 100 years as .30-06, or "Thirty ought six"[:D]