CHS Wishlist

[Don Bowen]

There've been a few suggestions for possible future enhancements to CHS posted on the forum. I've started this thread so they can be concentrated in one place.

Go for it!

[DuckofTindalos]

Add the Kikka and the P-80.

[TheElf]

The following excerpt comes in response to my post by Testarossa on the "LEVEL BOMBERS MINING" Thread. It is in regard to the USSRs anti-ship/mine capability, and speaks to the potential the Soviets had to fight the Combined Fleet in a Japanese invasion of Russia Scenario. I think all the A/C mentioned in the post could/should be made available as upgrades to the russians

Thanks to Testarossa for the info! :

They used Il-4 for torpedo attacks and mining. Il-4 used two torpedoes (don't remember exact names, will check after work). Low altitude and high altitude variants (this one was launched from 600-1800 m and than ran in circles in hope to hit something). Later they modified all high altitude launched ones into low altitude due to poor performance of the former. Il-4 was very unstable on the low-level torpedo runs, and had no automatics (very tiring to fly) so result were mixed.

Later they got A-20 through lend-lease, and used them for torpedo attacks. Another lend lease a/c used by Naval aviation was B-25, but i think they didn't carried torpedo. Catalinas were used on Northern Fleet by they carried no torpedoes to increase endurance. They modified Il-2 for torpedo attacks by removing cannons and some of the armour, still performance was low and numbers built were few. They achieved much better results with standard Il-2M3. Theoretically Tu-2 was able to carry torpedo but was never used as such.

Organizationally they were formed in "minno-torpedniy avia-polk" mine-torpedo air regiments of Soviet Navy. Most active of course were regiments of the Northern fleet 1941-1945, Baltic fleet 1944-1945, and Black sea fleet 1941-1944. Again without my book I cant give you exact composition in the Far East, but if memory serves me well, Soviet Union had 1 or 2 of those regiments attached to Pacific Fleet. Overall Soviets expended around 1000 air-launched torpedoes during the war, and Far East Command had something like 60 of them during the course of WW2.

[Subchaser]

ORIGINAL: TheElf

Soviet Union had 1 or 2 of those regiments attached to Pacific Fleet. Overall Soviets expended around 1000 air-launched torpedoes during the war, and Far East Command had something like 60 of them during the course of WW2. [/b]

This is incorrect

[TheElf]

ORIGINAL: Subchaser

ORIGINAL: TheElf

Soviet Union had 1 or 2 of those regiments attached to Pacific Fleet. Overall Soviets expended around 1000 air-launched torpedoes during the war, and Far East Command had something like 60 of them during the course of WW2. [/b]

This is incorrect

Sub could you be more specific? Further, could you comment on whether the capability should or should not be included in the Soviet OOB?

[Subchaser]

Only Soviet Army air force units are in the game, Pacific fleet aviation is not there, only naval units were equipped with IL-4T version capable to carry torpedoes and only Naval units were more or less trained for this job. If you want to see Il-4 with torps then entire Pacific fleet Naval aviation should be modeled

669 fighters, 201 level bombers, 179 torpedo bombers, 256 sturmoviks, 208 recons, 74 transports – 1587 aircraft were in PFNA units in june 1944. Don’t have numbers for 1941 at hand. Do we have enough slots for this?

[TheElf]

ORIGINAL: Subchaser

Only Soviet Army air force units are in the game, Pacific fleet aviation is not there, only naval units were equipped with IL-4T version capable to carry torpedoes and only Naval units were more or less trained for this job. If you want to see Il-4 with torps then entire Pacific fleet Naval aviation should be modeled

669 fighters, 201 level bombers, 179 torpedo bombers, 256 sturmoviks, 208 recons, 74 transports – 1587 aircraft were in PFNA units in june 1944. Don’t have numbers for 1941 at hand. Do we have enough slots for this?

Not sure about the slots available in the Database. Agree Pac Nav Air units not modeled. Should be for just the reason I mentioned in the Level bomber mining thread. If Japan invades Russia, how else would USSR have staved off amphib and Bombard TFs?

My PBEM experience screams "Soviet OOB needs help!" Failing the correct addition of Soviet Naval Aviation, and Soviet Navy, at a minimum the current Soviet Air Regiments could be given a limited Torpedo capability. Whatever seems accurate. Also there are a couple art slots available for Soviet versions of the A-20, B-25 etc.

[Don Bowen]

ORIGINAL: Subchaser

Only Soviet Army air force units are in the game, Pacific fleet aviation is not there, only naval units were equipped with IL-4T version capable to carry torpedoes and only Naval units were more or less trained for this job. If you want to see Il-4 with torps then entire Pacific fleet Naval aviation should be modeled

669 fighters, 201 level bombers, 179 torpedo bombers, 256 sturmoviks, 208 recons, 74 transports – 1587 aircraft were in PFNA units in june 1944. Don’t have numbers for 1941 at hand. Do we have enough slots for this?

No we do not. CHS has already used virtually all the allied Air group slots below 2200 (slots above 2200 are reserved for group division).

Our early investigations of the Soviet Fleet and the Chinese OOB also foundered on the limit of OOB positions.

[TheElf]

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

ORIGINAL: Subchaser

Only Soviet Army air force units are in the game, Pacific fleet aviation is not there, only naval units were equipped with IL-4T version capable to carry torpedoes and only Naval units were more or less trained for this job. If you want to see Il-4 with torps then entire Pacific fleet Naval aviation should be modeled

669 fighters, 201 level bombers, 179 torpedo bombers, 256 sturmoviks, 208 recons, 74 transports – 1587 aircraft were in PFNA units in june 1944. Don’t have numbers for 1941 at hand. Do we have enough slots for this?

No we do not. CHS has already used virtually all the allied Air group slots below 2200 (slots above 2200 are reserved for group division).

Our early investigations of the Soviet Fleet and the Chinese OOB also foundered on the limit of OOB positions.

I am going to research this, but at the moment I feel I can make a strong arguement for some things that might fit in the current architecture(sp?) of the CHS database:

1. A torpedo capability for selected Russian Aircraft

2. Addition of the B-25 and A-20 as Soviet upgrades. If we have one slot available in the aircraft DB we could make the A-20 at least torpedo capability. I know we have the art slots available to give them Soviet markings.

3. A small force of minelayers, if they in fact actually existed IRL using a generic allied ML type.

4. Any Russian ships if ship slots are available. SOMETHING at least.

5. Some kind of organic port defense for Vladivostok. If it existed IRL

[Lemurs!]

Personaly, i would just make it a house rule that nothing happens in Russia and don't play against people who won't abide by that.

I am a firm believer in giving players free will but the Japanese would have declared war on either Russia or the Western Allies not both.
The game is not set up to model the Russian military properly and it would be pure guess work to change most of the OOB.
We may add some coast defense guns in Vladivostock but that is about it.
We just do not have the slots to do this justice and i do not believe most of the propaganda that Stalin released about his military strength.

One of my colleagues at CATO years ago joked about Stalin's tank production numbers. He said something like
'Stalin claims his tanks have thicker, better sloped armour,and bigger guns in general, yet the Soviets lost tanks at something like a 15-1 ratio. The Soviet tanker must have really sucked!'

Mike

[Subchaser]

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

No we do not.

That was the point Don.

[Subchaser]

ORIGINAL: Lemurs!

Personaly, i would just make it a house rule that nothing happens in Russia and don't play against people who won't abide by that.

I am a firm believer in giving players free will but the Japanese would have declared war on either Russia or the Western Allies not both.
The game is not set up to model the Russian military properly and it would be pure guess work to change most of the OOB.
We may add some coast defense guns in Vladivostock but that is about it.
We just do not have the slots to do this justice and i do not believe most of the propaganda that Stalin released about his military strength.

I agree, this is War in the Pacific, and everything is tuned accordingly , any Kontakuten scenario requires new code and new OOB.

..at something like a 15-1 ratio. The Soviet tanker must have really sucked!'

Usually they say 50 or 60-1, sometimes even 100-1.

[Iridium]

Does every ship in CHS have artwork for it?...Same for planes. Unless I've totally screwed up my installation of CHS some lack artwork still. Of course it is quite possible that I have scewed up my installation.[:D]

[keeferon01]

wish I could have Jap Trains, then wish I could have a few squadron of typhoons to blow erm up.

[Don Bowen]

ORIGINAL: Iridium

Does every ship in CHS have artwork for it?...Same for planes. Unless I've totally screwed up my installation of CHS some lack artwork still. Of course it is quite possible that I have scewed up my installation.[:D]

Yes, CHS artwork is provided for every ship and plane. If you do not see them, I'm afraid you probably do have a screwed installaion.

[jcjordan]

Don some minor things not sure if they've been taken care of yet as I don't have laptop with me with game but some research I've done show that the Oanami should be Onami & the Kazegumo seems mostly to be Kazagumo but have seen it both ways guess someone with Japanese speaking skills would have to translate Kaze vs Kaza.
Also the Usugumo shouldn't be available until 6/42 due to damage suffered in S China Sea mine incident only IJN ship at start that way. Not sure if it would be better to have it start damaged or have it become avail in 6/42

[paladin333]

Kaze(wind)gumo(cloud), I am 100% sure that Kazegumo is a right variant.

cheers

[CobraAus]

3. A small force of minelayers, if they in fact actually existed IRL using a generic allied ML type.

4. Any Russian ships if ship slots are available. SOMETHING at least.

just to wet the whistle Elf

Cobra Aus

[CobraAus]

to Don or Andrew with the possible addition of soviet ships we would now need Repair
added to Vladivostok and Petropavlovsk . I have not found any detail yet on how big a repair
facility these ports had but they would have some. maybe Subchaser might have some details
+ any idea what experience to set the various class's too.

Cobra Aus

[TheElf]

Nice Cobra. Have you seen any documentation on Minelayers in the pacific fleet to warrant their addition or did you just put them in for grins?

As far as the IL-4T is concerned I think I have a solution. Since there are probably few people who have had the fortune to actually play with Russian forces, let me explain how I have been running them. SB-2s and IL-4s are upgraded ASAP. Leaving only Pe-2s (non-torp capable) and the IL-2 (mostly non-torp capable).

From what I have seen the mine torpedo regiments reflect a small portion of the total air assets in the Pacific Air Flotilla. Thus the answer is make one regiment IL-4 only. i.e non-upgradable. Further, limit the # of replacements such that they could realistically only keep one unit supplied. Then make the Russian IL-4 (not the IL-4c) torpedo capable in the editor, and violla! you have a mine torpedo regiment. You might even label as such.

Of course we would need to research when the MTAR arrived in the Far East...

Anyone have thoughts?