Production engine - more questions and lot of data

[BlackDog_slith]

Hi all,

I am still slowly trying to understand the whole production system and to help me on that I have created a few tables and excel spreadsheets.

For example I now have a complete Excel table listing all production-related bases data : resource centers, oil centers, Heavy Industries, Manpower centers, Shipyards, Factories, etc, sorted by countries... That's a lengthy table with more than 178 lines !

I now can do the sum of all such data in a whole area I am managing.

For example, if I focus on the Indochina-Siam-Malaya-Burma area (this is a complete area with inland supply roads, so I guess the system could manage inter-dependance of all bases for production needs), in 1942 as Japanese player I own inter-linked bases for a total of :

Resource Centers : 2800
Oil Centers (Inland) : 50
Oil Centers (Port) : 50
Heavy Industry (Inland) : 0
Heavy Industry (Port) : 630
Manpower Centers : 8

I am now trying to pour and stir all those numbers with formulas given inside the manual, in order to find the resulting data : do I need to import Oil and/or Resource points to this area, or can I export Oil or Resource to other areas ?

I created a small Excel formula using those numbers as data source. Here is the math :

[font="Courier New"]Oil Points (OP) = (6 * Oil Centers Inland) + (6 * Oil Centers Port)

Resource Points (RP) = 1.25 * Resource Centers

Manpower Points (MP) = 5 * Manpower Centers (it will also consumes RP, see below)

Heavy Industry Points (HIP) = Heavy Industry Inland + Heavy Industry Port (it will also consumes OP

and RP, see below)

Supply Points = Resource Centers + Heavy Industry Inland + Heavy Industry Port

Fuel Points = Oil Centers Ports + (1.33 * Heavy Industry Port)[/font]

So for Indochina-Siam-Malaya-Burma area I get :

OP = 600
RP = 3500
MP = 40
HIP = 630
Supply = 3430
Fuel = 887.9

This is all I get from my production system.

I must also substract from the OP and RP the amount consumed by the production of HIP, MP, fuel and supply :

for OP I need to substract :
HIP : consumed when supply + fuel are produced
+ 2 * HIP : consumed when HIP are produced

for RP I need to substract :
MP : consumed when Manpower Points are produced
+ HIP : consumed when supply + fuel are produced
+ 2 * HIP : consumed when HIP are produced

So for Indochina-Siam-Malaya-Burma area my final OP and RP numbers are :

OP = 600 - 630 - 2*630 = -1290
RP = 3500 - 40 - 630 - 2*630 = 2160

So from those numbers, and if my formulaes are correct, I have a positive balance of 2160 RP each day that I can export to other areas (Japan mostly), and I have a negative balance of -1290 OP that I need to import to this area in order to get a fully efficient production system.

Now for my questions about all this :

1. Am I right with those numbers ? or is there a fatal flaw somewhere inside those maths ??

2. If this is more or less correct, how can I be sure that I am able to import 1290 OP/day (or by month*30), and to export 2160 RP ???

3. Most important question : even if all this data above is correct, maybe is it better just to focus on trend of RP/OP/HIP pools on the main intelligence screen, and try to adjust production to get even pools ??? but doing this, how can I be sure that each independant production area (not linked to other areas by land) is able to get enough RP/OP to function properly ???

Thanks to the (few?) readers with enough courage to read all that

If I can get all those numbers right, and if there is interest for it, I will post my Excel tables.

Chris

[Arkan]

If I remember the last production threads correct then there are 2 errors:
HI produces 1 fuel not 1.33 and 1 HI point uses 1 res and 1 oil, not 2 of each.

I don't really understand your 2nd question. Regarding nr.3 I don't know what the resource pool is supposed to mean, haven't seen an oil pool yet. But I'm sure you have to transport resources and oil to the HI sites, so your calculations are definitly useful.

[FeurerKrieg]

I did this very same thing in Excel and although it isn't in front of me at the moment, your numbers seem to be about right, other than the things Arkan mentioned. It is useful as it helps you maximize what you can bring out and send back to the HI, which you want to do as early as possible since the more you can pile up at home, the longer your production can keep cranking once your supply lines to the SRA start getting cut.

[CapAndGown]

Here is a screenshot of part of the spreadsheet I use:



I should say that I only use the "supply at base" column for keeping track of my supply usage in the Home Islands.

[BlackDog_slith]

ORIGINAL: Arkan

If I remember the last production threads correct then there are 2 errors:
HI produces 1 fuel not 1.33 and 1 HI point uses 1 res and 1 oil, not 2 of each.

I don't really understand your 2nd question. Regarding nr.3 I don't know what the resource pool is supposed to mean, haven't seen an oil pool yet. But I'm sure you have to transport resources and oil to the HI sites, so your calculations are definitly useful.

Thanks for your reply, Arkan [:)]

1.33 (for fuel) is a number given in the official manual, I guess it has been modified since first print... Same for HI using 1 res and oil instead of 2. Your reply seems similar to other sources I checked since... and now my formulas seem to give better results...

About 2nd question : I was trying to ask (english being not my native language) how could I organize a steady stream of oil and resources between each independant (non linked by earth routes) production areas, so to import/export the right number of oil/resources between those areas. For example, indochina-siam-burma-malaya area needs some oil imports to run efficiently. I am not sure that auto convoys will provide what I need here, of course I could create continuous supply convoys myself...

About resource/oil pools : in the main intelligence reports window, choosing Industry/Resource Availability or Industry/Troops/Resource Pools give you global data on right side of the window.


You have for example oil : 1350 (20000) or resources : 2550 (15000) and my understanding of it is that the first number is your daily global production of oil/resource and the second () number is the amount of oil/resources in pools. Am I right ?

Chris

[Arkan]

I don't use auto convoy so I don't know how well it works. CS missions always load supplies and fuel automatically so they are not of much help for resource and oil transportation. I prefer to create big well-protected convoys, it's a bit more work doing it manually but at least I know what's going on.

You are right about the global oil and resource display, but as you said it won't tell you if the stuff is located where it's needed. I mixed it up with the resource and oil "In Pool Now" items you sometimes get. I think that's a bug because oil and resources are not supposed to be available in global pools, though they are sometimes even listed as "Used from Pool".

[tsimmonds]

I was trying to ask (english being not my native language) how could I organize a steady stream of oil and resources between each independant (non linked by earth routes) production areas, so to import/export the right number of oil/resources between those areas.

I agree with Arkan's advice. CS convoys don't work for resource/oil, and I would not entrust this (or any other) important task to the auto-convoy system. Don't try to "organize a steady stream." Sounds great in theory but it is far easier (if less elegant) to simply slam 100,000 oil into Singapore or Saigon every 2-3 months and be done with it. Do the same with Formosa. Haul away the excess resources as they build up.

[Mike Solli]

I've been working on a similar spreadsheet for the past couple of months that will be posted on Spooky's website. I've got the spreadsheet done, but am wrestling with the instructions (which are more complicated than I originally thought). I hope to get it to Spooky this week.

One thing I've realized is that you don't have to mess with the whole oil/resource thing every day. I update my spreadsheet 1-2 times a month. It's time consuming to update the oil/resource levels. I look at how many months of each are at each "complex", which is a geographic area that is linked by rail. So, for example, Japan is divided into 3 complexes. They are Japan, Hokkaido, and Sakhalin. I also have Burma and French Indochina as separate complexes because they are isolated. The list goes on...

Mike

[FeurerKrieg]

I approach it with a monthly point of view also. So I figure out how much oil/rescources a given area is short of per month, then multiply that by 2 or 3 and send a convoy with that much oil/res to that region.

As far as the excess, I tend to bring that home insmaller convoys since it tends to be easier to see the extra piling up.

[BlackDog_slith]

Thanks guys, it's quite clear now.... I just need to be able to manage all that by myself now [:D] I guess that using a few Excel tables with a monthly management goal should be doable...

Regards,
Chris

[Terminus]

I'm just sort of hobbling along myself... At first, I naively thought I could let them manage themselves; I was very quickly disabused of that notion![;)]

[John III]

I experienced the same thing. I was excited when 1.6 'fixed' the auto-convoy system but, in game terms, that was three months ago and my Japanese industry has ground to a halt. Discovered this about two game weeks ago and am starting to correct it. Will probably take another month of game time to REALLY see if it is fixed. Live and learn.

[morphin]

Mike,
Have you finished your EXCEL-file? I'm very intrested!

Thanks
Andy

[ilovestrategy]

You need an EXEL sheet just to play? [X(] (tries to pick up jaw off of ground) [:D]

[Terminus]

You don't NEED one... Some people just like to make things more complicated...[:D]