How frequent does application use original scenario data & A CHOICE/UPDATE EVERY YEAR?

[viberpol]

Two thoughts:

1. A question:
It may sound stupid for veteran moders but I just wonder -- how often does application invokes to scenario data (origin) during play?
If I change some data (say some ship armament in scenario 15) it does not change instantly in saves from the scenario I play just today.
But will it change it some day in the future if I continue to play?
For example when it needs to read some extra data from the origin scenario database every month (and then would update the armament?)??

2. el cid again touches the center of my heart with his question and proposal of giving the player (especially japanese) a CHOICE. I strongly agree with his idea. Player should have many, many, ships available and be able to choose which of them can, and should be build.
I would have an opportunity to order in my shipyards 2 brand new Zuikakus, and abandon all submarines manufacturing (halt it).
One of the prerogatives for the japanese player would be to THINK BEFORE and start production of ships given (all of them could be halted at the beginning).
Of course this is a mod you should call an Evolution Mod [;)] and it stops being a historical one. BUT WITP BECOMES EVEN MORE PLAYABLE THEN.
What do you think?

[Nikademus]

Scenario data is accessed once, at the start of the scenario in question. Regrettably this means that any changes you make to your custom scenario (via the editor) wont go into effect until you restart that scenario

[steveh11Matrix]

It also means that if you make a mistake, and something that's supposed to come in 1943 doesn't come until 1944, or you add a ship and forget to set it's nationality, you're stuck with either going on and accepting the problem or starting again.

Yes, I've done both of those.... [:o]

Steve.

[viberpol]

Yes... Nikademus, this is pity...
but I'd like to draw your attention to one idea:

I am not an expert on WITP, but i used to read big part of topics from this forum, and sometimes make my own changes to the game, and what I realized that the main problem is: lack of free slotes. Am I right?

This lack is the most painfull if you need to introduce new plane...
I had a dream application should read new data every year from scenarios located in different folders - say 15a, 15b, 15c! This would ease our pain! Every years' scenario data would get rid of useless planes (say B4Y, kI27 etc.) and, instead, introduce new ones (in old slots).
Imagine George's versions N1K1, N1K2, N1K3... and very fast version of Jack (J2M5). Isn't it tempting?
Do you think it is feasible for Matrix?

[Nikademus]

Imagine George's versions N1K1, N1K2, N1K3... and very fast version of Jack (J2M5). Isn't it tempting?

It depends. If the varient in question has OOB representable stats (values) that are substantially different enough, they can make an impact. Marginal and in some cases, even moderate differences will not show up in the game as producing much (if any) of a noticable difference in preformance.

Do you think it is feasible for Matrix?

I'm afraid not. Large scale coding changes are being mostly restricted to bug fixes. Mike did opt to rewrite the ASW coding but this was made largely possible by the existance of a tweaked model based on War Plan Orange (upcoming WitP mod) so the changed routine was already partially in place.

There are no absolutes mind you but the probability is low as Mike needs to focus on WiE.

[viberpol]

If the application does not check its data with scenario... do you know what does it mean??
It means that my japanese opponent in PBEM game can change scenario data (for example ETA in scenario 4, save it in other slot, open a new PBEM) and I would not even notice?
I do not believe... Please advice.

[Bodhi]

ORIGINAL: viberpol

If the application does not check its data with scenario... do you know what does it mean??
It means that my japanese opponent in PBEM game can change scenario data (for example ETA in scenario 4, save it in other slot, open a new PBEM) and I would not even notice?
I do not believe... Please advice.

The scenario data is only used when a game is first started. How exactly do your think your opponent could cheat even though this is the case?

[viberpol]

It is simple. As the CHS scenario is lets say in slot 155, it is not protected.
The japanese player who starts the game, can change ANY data (his ETA, number of planes in Daitais, number of available resources, pilot starting pool etc.) Am I right?
Then he/she sends a save file -- and then, if the scenario is not compared to the "original" data, we have just started and I must accept these changes. Simply because I cannot prove it...

[DuckofTindalos]

The game only accesses scenario data once, at the very beginning. Everything else is done through the savegames. You'd need a savegame editor, not a scenario editor, to cheat.

[viberpol]

Well, just once is sometimes enough...
BTW: does any savegame editor exist?
Is it available?

[steveh11Matrix]

If it does, you're all keeping it secret from me... [:-]

AFAIK there is no SaveGame editor, nor any other utility that works in any way with saved games, unless it's one that's restricted to the Devs.

[Andrew Brown]

ORIGINAL: viberpol

It is simple. As the CHS scenario is lets say in slot 155, it is not protected.
The japanese player who starts the game, can change ANY data (his ETA, number of planes in Daitais, number of available resources, pilot starting pool etc.) Am I right?
Then he/she sends a save file -- and then, if the scenario is not compared to the "original" data, we have just started and I must accept these changes. Simply because I cannot prove it...

Good point. Maybe that is the case. I don't know if the scenario data is checked on the Allied side on the first turn to ensure that the Japanese player has not tampered with it...

[DuckofTindalos]

Hmm, there is the "This Campaign has been Modified" bit, on the Options screen in-game. That has to come from somewhere.

[viberpol]

Yes, but the CHS is from the very beginning a "user modified" campaign.
How does it differentiate one modification from another?
And this is my point -- some kind of a CRC check, or whatever on both computers...
...and this is also where the idea "update scenario once per year" could be introduced and free some slots for us [:D]

[Bodhi]

OK, I see what you're saying now: the Japanese player could have modified the scenario database files before the game is started. Yes, this is a possibility and I don't think there's a way to check this. I guess you'll just have to trust your opponent.

[steveh11Matrix]

Gasp! trust a PBEM opponent? Don't you know that all PBEM opponents will explore all possible methods to cheat at all times? [:-]

The paranoia surrounding PBEM players is, I find, quite impossible to understand. If you suspect your opponent of cheating, stop playing with him.

In this particular case: If the Japanese player has changed his datafiles, won't there be a mismatch between his and yours? Isn't there some kind of in-game check? If not, why the insistence on encrypted savegame files?

Steve.

[DuckofTindalos]

Hmm, it might produce more synchronicity problems...

[Nikademus]

ORIGINAL: steveh11Matrix

Gasp! trust a PBEM opponent? Don't you know that all PBEM opponents will explore all possible methods to cheat at all times? [:-]

It has happened in the past. A set of saves was received a while back that proved that one player had in fact, found a way to hack a save and was using it to cheat. Personally i've never understood the desire to cheat in PBEM, particularily in a game like this that requires such a ginormous investment of time. (You can whip the AI without cheating and in much shorter a period of time!)

One reason why its always best to PBEM with someone you know.

[DuckofTindalos]

Also more fun that way...

Nobody but losers cheat at PBEM.