What to do with non-US Forces?

[Mike Carroll]

OK I am playing an AI campaign as the Allies and I have some questions on where the Dutch, British, French and Australians fit in with the back story. I am playing the 1922 scenario.

The Japanese and Americans are at war. I think it makes sense for merchant ships to runs supplies for the US etc. I am less certain about the warships and ground forces. I know there are several things in place to restrict their use (like the British at 1/3 strength) but I think it still needs some more development.

For example would British and Dutch subs attack Japanese shipping? They are not formally at war. I can see these forces deploying to protect their colonies but without an overt act of war by the Japanese would the naval forces actively participate?

In the scenario 3 French Cruisers start out enroute to Manila? Are the French in a state of war with Japan?

Here are some restrictions that I think make sense but would like some comment on how they effect play balance.

1) Non-US Forces do not start the scenario at war with Japan or active. They may move freely between their possessions.

2) British and French forces will actively defend Hong Kong and Shang Hai.

3) All allied bases and merchant ships can be used to support the US fleet (Colonial powers sticking together). These ships can only be escorted by warships from active powers. Japanese attacks against allied merchant shipping in the war zone will not activate a power.

4) Once attacked by the Japanese that particular Allied power will become active in the war. An attack is defined as a land or sea attack against a powers base or warships. Except Japanese forces in Shang Hai will not activate the British, French or Chinese. The British and French may attack the Japanese in Shang Hai and eject their garrison there. A Japanese attack against Hong Kong would activate the British. In my AI game the Japanese ran a Bombardment mission against Raboul. This activated the Australians and New Zealanders.

5) Chinese forces may be used to attack into Korea if so desired. But only after Port Arthur has been taken.

OK there are better ideas. My main concern is does this shift the play balance too much to the Japanese? Should we change the back story to a state of war between Japan and everyone else?

[Tankerace]

This was always a tricky part. I for one didn't want to impose hard coded limits, as my entire point with the game was to allow a free hand.

That said, in AI mode I do think that Allied forces (all but US and French) should be treated as neutral. The AI bombarding Rabaul was an attempt to keep ANZAC troops in the South Pacific theater. However, I am reassigning those TFs to avoid that particular mission.

My idea for basic WPO house rules (for AI play. IMO, in PBEM anything goes):

1. China. Any large operations in China should only be mounted if the AI attacks first. Korea should be avoided until at least mainland China is clear.

2. Neutrality. British and Commonwealth should be Neutral until attacked, or until 1924/1928.

3. France and the USA should be considered as at war with France (the 3 cruisers are a "loan" to the US to bolster its defenses.

4. Until the Australians and New Zealanders become active participants, no US warships may use their bases. This reflects the fact that the SU wasn't buddy buddy with everyone in the 1920s.

The fact is I didn't want anything like this hard coded, because I wanted players to do whatever they wished with regards to PBEM. However, with the AI, you do need to limit yourself to plausible history (i.e., if you bring everything out of Malaya and stuff it in the PI. that never would have happened. And it wont after the first patch [;)]. Going to be hard to remove what isn't there.)

[Mike Carroll]

I like those rules, I think I will still hold that Port Arthur must be taken before additional operations can be taken in Korea. Or is Port Arthur part of China anyway?

I am ok with the US/France being active participants at the start of the game. At least French Naval forces.

I also like to have a time when all other powers become activated. Does the game engine support something like British become active Jan 24/28 or when the Japanese reach a certain victory point level (maybe something of random number within a range so the Japanese player can not be gamey).

I still think that even in PBEM there will probably be some honor rules reguarding activation of non-US forces. In fact I do not see any real problems with the rules you specified and the ones I specified for a PBEM game.

I have not had a turn in two weeks in one of my WITP games. If that game ends I will be starting a WPO game instead - so we will see how it works.

[Tankerace]

ORIGINAL: Mike Carroll

I also like to have a time when all other powers become activated. Does the game engine support something like British become active Jan 24/28 or when the Japanese reach a certain victory point level (maybe something of random number within a range so the Japanese player can not be gamey).

That would probably require a large code change, so I don't think it would be possible.

That said, that is why most British LCU's and Naval ships don't arrive until 1925/29. There can be skirmishes before then, but the British don't jump in with both feet until then.

[Mike Carroll]

Well I certainly understand that. Then for PBEM we would just use an honor rule on activation. Something like

British/Australian/New Zealand - 1924 / 1928

Dutch only if attacked

I have had a lot of fun so far keep up the good work.

[Jaypea]

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

The fact is I didn't want anything like this hard coded, because I wanted players to do whatever they wished with regards to PBEM. However, with the AI, you do need to limit yourself to plausible history (i.e., if you bring everything out of Malaya and stuff it in the PI. that never would have happened. And it wont after the first patch [;)]. Going to be hard to remove what isn't there.)

Instead of removing the British/India forces, just make Southeast Asia a restricted HQ that you need to pay PP's to move units by ship?

I like that better than removing the forces. This way for PBEM Malaya and India are not wide open to attack.

JP

[Tankerace]

The only forces I am going to remove are the Indian Divisions, The Bdes and such will still be at 1/3 strength for any use.

[jwilkerson]

original: Tankerace

3. France and the USA should be considered as at war with France

I guess the French really have always been at war with the French - but the USA ? Nah !!!
[:D][:D][:D]

[Tankerace]

LOL... That's what I get for speed typing while doing stuff for new ship classes.