I am still a bit confused about management of my core force during campaigns. Is it so that the type and number of units I purchase at the beginning cannot be changed later?
e.g if I buy
A0 HQ
B0-5 tanks
C0-4 engineers infantry
....
X0-4 88mm Flak
Y0-4 Skdf - 7 (prime movers)
my B company will always be armour, C infantry and Y auxiliaries?
There is no way to get rid of Y company in exchange for let's say another tank company??? In other ways, if I buy trucks at my core force in 1939, I am stuck with truck till 1945? more or less?
Also, if my B company is 5 tanks at the start, is there any way to make it 8 tanks during campaign? I mean other than making my other core 3tanks less?
A0 - myself! could I have other units in A command? I mean I can ... assign them in one scenario, they become destroyed, repair them later...they are there, but something is wrong here. Am I supposed to have more units in A company? Or is it a kind of cheat /bug exploitation?
A0 -again. It's infantry generaly, but the only one that could be "upgraded" to armour. If I upgrade HQ to armour, do I loose the HQ ability? Like ressuply and morale boost? Or are they retained? Ok, maybe to armour isn't good idea, armour could be *boomed* with one hit, but better infantry maybe? Like engineers?
lot of questions, I know, but I am confused and even SPIII manual did't save me.
Renwor
core force
Moderator: MOD_SPWaW
Hope I didn't confuse you more. Be sure to read through the other posts you aren't the only one learning here.Originally posted by renwor:
I am still a bit confused about management of my core force during campaigns. Is it so that the type and number of units I purchase at the beginning cannot be changed later?
e.g if I buy
A0 HQ
B0-5 tanks
C0-4 engineers infantry
....
X0-4 88mm Flak
Y0-4 Skdf - 7 (prime movers)
my B company will always be armour, C infantry and Y auxiliaries?
There is no way to get rid of Y company in exchange for let's say another tank company??? In other ways, if I buy trucks at my core force in 1939, I am stuck with truck till 1945? more or less?
>As of this version of W@W all your core units remain in their class. We all get inventive with our basic choices, get something cheap just to upgrade later. How you go about this takes practice in knowing what can be upgraded to what and you've got to win. For example go with cheaper units than the 88 and Skdf-7 and upgrade after a battle, this will give you more points to spend on your core. The only unit that can become what ever you wish is, as you've seen, the HQ.
>
Also, if my B company is 5 tanks at the start, is there any way to make it 8 tanks during campaign? I mean other than making my other core 3tanks less?
>No. But lets say you bought 3 trucks and 3 snipers in the start. After the first battle you upgrade the trucks to halftracks and the snipers to 2 engineers and a heavy MG you can assign them all to your tank outfit if you want, making it 11 instead of 5. This example is really not a good idea. Don't join the groups together that way you'll have better chances to pass moral checks.
>
A0 - myself! could I have other units in A command? I mean I can ... assign them in one scenario, they become destroyed, repair them later...they are there, but something is wrong here. Am I supposed to have more units in A company? Or is it a kind of cheat /bug exploitation?
>I think you might be speaking of a bug in the game. If you have a tank destroyed but the crew survives, and you fix the tank the crew stays a crew. You have to upgrade or replace the damaged tank to have the crew re-man it. If you fix it you get a green crew in the tank. Yes you can assign the left over crew to the HQ unit and change them into infantry. I'm not sure if you've found a bug or it's the one I've just talked about?
>
A0 -again. It's infantry generaly, but the only one that could be "upgraded" to armour. If I upgrade HQ to armour, do I loose the HQ ability? Like ressuply and morale boost? Or are they retained? Ok, maybe to armour isn't good idea, armour could be *boomed* with one hit, but better infantry maybe? Like engineers?
>I don't think the HQ will resupply anything, I've not looked. No the unit will not lose it's morale boost, it goes by rank and unit. I always used to upgrade my HQ to armour, but with the better infantry model in W@W I'm much less inclined to do so. It's all up to you.
>
lot of questions, I know, but I am confused and even SPIII manual did't save me.
Renwor
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Hell On Wheels
[This message has been edited by Pack Rat (edited 05-19-2000).]
PR
Hello, although cumbersome, and could be construed as a cheat by some, if confronted, after the fix/upgrade screen, with the situation where you were unable to upgrade a certain item the way you wanted, I do this; start the next scenario of the campaign, save it. Go to explorer, and find the save file, change the saveXX.dat to scenXX (where the XX is an unused scenario number),and place in the scenario folder. Go to the editor and open this scenario, find the unit you wanted to change and go to it, to make up for this workaround, I usually raise the price of the "special upgraded" units so that the computer will gain more points from destroying it, that way I am more likely to pay special attention to it's use and survival!! You may alter any aspect, by the way, of the particular scenario in the campaign this way, I use it to make a better map for the scenario than the generated, have changed the nation against, the stance of the scenario, etc, etc,. Anyway, after you have changed what you will, save the scenXX.dat, exit the editor, go to explorer again change the file back to saveXX.dat(the original saveXX. dat #), and put back in the save folder. This works flawlessly, and can make a sometimes uninteresting campaign very exiting! BTW, you can add reinforcements this way also, and expand yours and opponents forces. Lots of options!! Enjoy,Originally posted by renwor:
I am still a bit confused about management of my core force during campaigns. Is it so that the type and number of units I purchase at the beginning cannot be changed later?
e.g if I buy
A0 HQ
B0-5 tanks
C0-4 engineers infantry
....
X0-4 88mm Flak
Y0-4 Skdf - 7 (prime movers)
my B company will always be armour, C infantry and Y auxiliaries?
There is no way to get rid of Y company in exchange for let's say another tank company??? In other ways, if I buy trucks at my core force in 1939, I am stuck with truck till 1945? more or less?
Also, if my B company is 5 tanks at the start, is there any way to make it 8 tanks during campaign? I mean other than making my other core 3tanks less?
A0 - myself! could I have other units in A command? I mean I can ... assign them in one scenario, they become destroyed, repair them later...they are there, but something is wrong here. Am I supposed to have more units in A company? Or is it a kind of cheat /bug exploitation?
A0 -again. It's infantry generaly, but the only one that could be "upgraded" to armour. If I upgrade HQ to armour, do I loose the HQ ability? Like ressuply and morale boost? Or are they retained? Ok, maybe to armour isn't good idea, armour could be *boomed* with one hit, but better infantry maybe? Like engineers?
lot of questions, I know, but I am confused and even SPIII manual did't save me.
Renwor
Warhorse
renwor: One quick thing, DON"T buy trucks as the core force!!!!!!! They have miniscule ability to gain from experience (better firing range of two pistols is hardly an offensive dream). Better yet, let's say you need heavy trucks for the 88's. Buy the 88's as core (let's say you buy a section [2 I think it is]), and ALWAYS buy your 2 heavy trucks in support, FIRST THING, so you don't forget the trucks that way.
On a related train of thought, as the others have been saying, to some degree anyway, the cheaper forces you buy, the more units you can have. Myself, since I considered the Poles so non-threatening, I started not with 88's but with 20mm AA's which I upgraded the next battle to 88's. On the other hand, and this is just me, though my 88's are very important, you can see how I might be able to afford to wait, given the first opponent, however, you, like I, have to consider just which things have to be top-notch from the start so they suffer as little upgrading as possible. For me, that is core engineers. I mandatorily carry two platoons of engineers, so they get more experience quicker, and even on that first battle are helping detect mines and helping the other units dig in quicker where applicable. Naturally, just as with the 88's I will protect my engineers if possible, and their considerable firepower is reserved for last-ditch defenses around the objectives. The neat thing about engineers, unlike most other units, is that their gain in experience helps in other ways than just combat, for their better experience (when carried as core) results in affecting other units abilities to dig in (when adjacent) and in their ability to detect and remove mines. I notice that the German engineers seem better equipped then before, as I believe they carry flamethrowers now, and given the vast possibilities of this games availability of pillboxes, their gaining experience as rapidly as possible is even more important.
On a related train of thought, as the others have been saying, to some degree anyway, the cheaper forces you buy, the more units you can have. Myself, since I considered the Poles so non-threatening, I started not with 88's but with 20mm AA's which I upgraded the next battle to 88's. On the other hand, and this is just me, though my 88's are very important, you can see how I might be able to afford to wait, given the first opponent, however, you, like I, have to consider just which things have to be top-notch from the start so they suffer as little upgrading as possible. For me, that is core engineers. I mandatorily carry two platoons of engineers, so they get more experience quicker, and even on that first battle are helping detect mines and helping the other units dig in quicker where applicable. Naturally, just as with the 88's I will protect my engineers if possible, and their considerable firepower is reserved for last-ditch defenses around the objectives. The neat thing about engineers, unlike most other units, is that their gain in experience helps in other ways than just combat, for their better experience (when carried as core) results in affecting other units abilities to dig in (when adjacent) and in their ability to detect and remove mines. I notice that the German engineers seem better equipped then before, as I believe they carry flamethrowers now, and given the vast possibilities of this games availability of pillboxes, their gaining experience as rapidly as possible is even more important.
Do buy trucks for your core force...you can use then as upgrade fodder later and the are cheap! LOL how about that for conflicting advice. Here's how I approach purchase in the LC: I'll us the US Army as I usuall play that...
1. Purchase foot infantry Companies cause they are complete units but cheap.
2. Buy a Company of Tanks, switch one or two platoons to M8 Armd Cars..again cheap
3. Buy several sections of M-8 to change later for TD's, light tanks or specilized vehicles like dozers.
4. Buy plts of light trucks (jeeps) They are the cheapest I'll change them later to halftracks for the infantry.
In this way I can end upt with two full Infantry Companies One full Armor Co...and assorted TDs, scout cars..whatever... Smart shopping tips...LOL
1. Purchase foot infantry Companies cause they are complete units but cheap.
2. Buy a Company of Tanks, switch one or two platoons to M8 Armd Cars..again cheap
3. Buy several sections of M-8 to change later for TD's, light tanks or specilized vehicles like dozers.
4. Buy plts of light trucks (jeeps) They are the cheapest I'll change them later to halftracks for the infantry.
In this way I can end upt with two full Infantry Companies One full Armor Co...and assorted TDs, scout cars..whatever... Smart shopping tips...LOL
Mark: You can see that the difference between picking a German core and an American one is vast, though I would NEVER pick a basically non-armed truck as core, even if I were campaigning American. I notice you're going MAXIMUM lightests units so you can to achieve max units, the only problem is, that this is easy to do with Americans when facing the Japanese, but try that against the Poles or French (as Gerry) and you'll lose half of your force.
BTW, one of the most useful weapons for early Gerry, is the PZI. I'm thinking about carrying a platoon of them for as long as possible, thereby having an EXTREMELY effective anti-infantry group, while at the same time I can concentrate more points on upgrading a consdierable anti-tank force with the other tanks and 88's.
BTW, one of the most useful weapons for early Gerry, is the PZI. I'm thinking about carrying a platoon of them for as long as possible, thereby having an EXTREMELY effective anti-infantry group, while at the same time I can concentrate more points on upgrading a consdierable anti-tank force with the other tanks and 88's.
Charles: I should have added one other small note...I always pray for the Italians! LOL....If I do get the Italians I'm able to deal with them and get some TD punch for the germans as well as so Half track mobility for the infantry. My personal feeling is that in the Long Campaign the US Army in North Africa has the toughest time of it. Even your best equipment is sub par against the Germans. Actually I hope that the next SPWAW patch will make it even more difficult as well as historically accurate...No M10 TD's until March '43, same for Bazookas...That way you'll face the Germans at Kasserine witha force compostion like the US actually had on hand. Need to add the M3 GMC 75mm in the TD roll. I love the Pz 1. as well as the T 38...just like the old small gunned tanks that were there at the start...LOVE the Stuart...
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Desert Fox
- Posts: 171
- Joined: Tue May 09, 2000 8:00 am
- Location: Ohio, that is all I can say.
I completely agree with Mark on this one. I buy lots of cheapo units early to ultimately upgrade into lots of strong units. My main force is a tank company and at least one infantry company, preferrably two. After that I buy armored cars to upgrade to SP-arty, TDs, and flak. I usually don't buy loads of cheap upgradeable inf, but that is because the original units are enough for me. I buy a bunch of jeeps/trucks/whatever to upgrade to halftracks, but more importantly, ammo carriers. Ammo carriers are far too expensive to keep buying as support. Engineers are good, but I don't need them for a while, so I simply upgrade a few infantry platoons to contain engineers.
I find that the best anti-infantry units are sp-flak units, so a lot of my armored cars are upgraded to these.
For germans I do pretty much the same thing. 38t tanks are more than enough to take out the early Polish and French units, even the British fall quickly to them. And don't underestimate a platoon of 221 armored cars, they can really do a number on infantry and are really cheap. I won my first few battles in the German campaign by taking out the tanks first with my 38ts, then taking out the inf with a couple of armored car platoons.
In the end it is all about preference. Whether to have a few, fully capable units or to have a lot of upgradeable units is wholey up to the player.
I find that the best anti-infantry units are sp-flak units, so a lot of my armored cars are upgraded to these.
For germans I do pretty much the same thing. 38t tanks are more than enough to take out the early Polish and French units, even the British fall quickly to them. And don't underestimate a platoon of 221 armored cars, they can really do a number on infantry and are really cheap. I won my first few battles in the German campaign by taking out the tanks first with my 38ts, then taking out the inf with a couple of armored car platoons.
In the end it is all about preference. Whether to have a few, fully capable units or to have a lot of upgradeable units is wholey up to the player.
I'll tell you what bums me out a bit, and that is when I first started an experimental campaign I decided to start Gerry against Ruskie in '41. There, I was able, or so it seems, to pick from a 2,000+ core force. But I decided that the experience against the weaker opponents of France/Poland was more important, however, the starting core is much smaller, which is around 1,290. With 2,000 points you can get both quantity and quality, but 1,290 leaves you with having to go with a lot more cheaper units than I've had to in SP3. I never thought I would see the day when I would actually start out with 20mm flaks instead of the 88's, but corners had to be cut.
I CANNOT BELIEVE WHAT I JUST READ!!! Supply trucks as core??????????? IF, if, the truck shoved out rounds quicker for experience gained, I might see that. Doesn't it occur to y'all that core forces should be FIGHTERS, therefore experience actually does something? What the use in having a non-combatant with elite status? Perhaps to show you somewhat my different mindset, I pick, so far anyway, only one supply truck, and that's from support. The PZIVC and supply truck are basically the same expense. That supply truck in core, is keeping you from a PZIVC gaining experience over time. perhaps the reason I don't need so much ammo, is because my units gain enough experience to where they don't need as much. But, then, Gerry starts out pretty experienced anyway, but still, you can see the contrast I hope.
In my playing against the 19 man Polish infantry squads, my infantry is even running low on supply, though the tank mg's haven't fully been realized yet. BUT, as as soon as I can upgrade some of my lowly PZ35's to some vehicles with more HE shot, hopefully not neglecting AP shot, then that and the PZI's will help immensely.
On a side note, what is the purpose for a HQ depot, and what about the FUEL depot? No unit has any fuel that I can see (maybe it's just for flair). Aren't supply trucks and supply depots the only way to go? What do the others do for you, that these do not?
In my playing against the 19 man Polish infantry squads, my infantry is even running low on supply, though the tank mg's haven't fully been realized yet. BUT, as as soon as I can upgrade some of my lowly PZ35's to some vehicles with more HE shot, hopefully not neglecting AP shot, then that and the PZI's will help immensely.
On a side note, what is the purpose for a HQ depot, and what about the FUEL depot? No unit has any fuel that I can see (maybe it's just for flair). Aren't supply trucks and supply depots the only way to go? What do the others do for you, that these do not?
Hey Bill, love the pillboxes. I picked one in support against the Poles and the closest the enemy got in an otherwsie threatened objective area hill was two hexes (and this with a visibility of six). Perhaps the most fun with the pillbox/bunker units is trying to pick the right one for the assault that's coming.
Hey guys, on a side note, back to supply problems, you'll also find that your supply lasts longer, when you concentrate fire on hexes which have multiple foot units. I particularly like when I maybe have five tanks to choose to fire upon, and they're all about equal distance away, and open up on the ones with infantry in the hex and see the infantry start falling to some of the mg fire meant for the tank. Which of course, on defense, I try to keep my infantry OUT of tank hexes.
BTW, guys, I'm glad we lost the 'drifting fire' aspect. You know, the fire that drifted into an adjacent hex, whereas mg fire against another tank could inflict harm possibly on not only the target hex, but any of the adjacent ones. I'm glad that's history.
Hey guys, on a side note, back to supply problems, you'll also find that your supply lasts longer, when you concentrate fire on hexes which have multiple foot units. I particularly like when I maybe have five tanks to choose to fire upon, and they're all about equal distance away, and open up on the ones with infantry in the hex and see the infantry start falling to some of the mg fire meant for the tank. Which of course, on defense, I try to keep my infantry OUT of tank hexes.
BTW, guys, I'm glad we lost the 'drifting fire' aspect. You know, the fire that drifted into an adjacent hex, whereas mg fire against another tank could inflict harm possibly on not only the target hex, but any of the adjacent ones. I'm glad that's history.
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Larry Holt
- Posts: 1644
- Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2000 10:00 am
- Location: Atlanta, GA 30068
Well, I do have transport and supply in my core. The concept of core and support was one designer's idea, not the only one. I deploy and fight my forces in a rather organised manner (recon up front, art in the rear, etc.) and having a complete combined arms team in order on my troop list really helps me (especially when I get interuppted and have to figure out where I was). I cheated in the selection of my core force (see separate threads on changing unit costs or editing as a scenario) and could buy an all-arms kampfgruppe. I rarely buy any support units, except for aircraft or barges.Originally posted by Charles22:
I CANNOT BELIEVE WHAT I JUST READ!!! Supply trucks as core??????????? IF, if, the truck shoved out rounds quicker for experience gained, I might see that. Doesn't it occur to y'all that core forces should be FIGHTERS, therefore experience actually does something? What the use in having a non-combatant with elite status? [snip as a libation to the bandwidth gods]
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An old soldier but not yet a faded one.
Never take counsel of your fears.
Larry: So how many supply trucks and supply HQ's do you have? And while you're at it, do you fit those other depots in? Is it a matter of jacking you core force's total up so much that you don't care about the support balancing with the core? On the positive side, at least from my perspective, I suppose not choosing support would diminish the opponents force size, but then I don't like smaller forces anyway.
The problem I have with doing what you're doing Larry, is that if ever I should discuss the game with someone I know directly, there's no way we can measure performances on when we don't abide by the systems limitations, which you seem to be breeching there. Yeah, I know you may never have that situation, but at least in my case, I can compare some of my results with the earlier battles in SP1 and SP3, or for that matter with Panzer Strike. What a revolution that game was, aye?
The problem I have with doing what you're doing Larry, is that if ever I should discuss the game with someone I know directly, there's no way we can measure performances on when we don't abide by the systems limitations, which you seem to be breeching there. Yeah, I know you may never have that situation, but at least in my case, I can compare some of my results with the earlier battles in SP1 and SP3, or for that matter with Panzer Strike. What a revolution that game was, aye?
I never leave the buy screen for core units with any points to spend. If that means buying trucks,snipers anything cheap I do it. I figure out something to change them to, or leave them as I may in this version. Those snipers are deadly, fast units like cheap jeeps are good for a dash to rescue valuable crew and so on. To get back to the point I was trying to make to renwor, I wouldn't on purpose buy a truck if I had other options for the core, you've got to look ahead though. I was just trying to let him see there were other options in a campign. You guys know that and I know that but I don't think renwor did.
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Hell On Wheels
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Hell On Wheels
PR
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Desert Fox
- Posts: 171
- Joined: Tue May 09, 2000 8:00 am
- Location: Ohio, that is all I can say.
I think you are very confused about what I mean. I do NOT buy ammo trucks with the original purchase. I buy cheap jeeps or trucks to later UPGRADE to ammo trucks. 40 points is ridiculous to throw away during the original purchasing for a single ammo truck. However, for those 40 points, you can buy 10 to 13 cheap units that can all be later upgraded to ammo trucks. That is 400 points of support you can get for 40 core points. Talk about a force multiplier. And maybe you don't need 10 ammo trucks, make some of those cheap vehicles into halftracks. Get enough cheap vehicles originally, and you can buy a foot infantry company early, then assign them halftracks when you can afford it. Then you can spend money you would have spent on mechanized infantry to buy better tanks or some on board artillery. In the end, you get big battles and lots more experience for killing the larger AI forces. I like my brigade to be a completely self sufficient brigade. That means that any support points I spend isn't buying artillery or ammo trucks that I don't have, its buying cannon fodder or airstrikes or a big minefield or a bunch of forts.Originally posted by Charles22:
I CANNOT BELIEVE WHAT I JUST READ!!! Supply trucks as core??????????? IF, if, the truck shoved out rounds quicker for experience gained, I might see that. Doesn't it occur to y'all that core forces should be FIGHTERS, therefore experience actually does something? What the use in having a non-combatant with elite status? Perhaps to show you somewhat my different mindset, I pick, so far anyway, only one supply truck, and that's from support. The PZIVC and supply truck are basically the same expense. That supply truck in core, is keeping you from a PZIVC gaining experience over time. perhaps the reason I don't need so much ammo, is because my units gain enough experience to where they don't need as much. But, then, Gerry starts out pretty experienced anyway, but still, you can see the contrast I hope.
And I really don't know if experience has any effect on how well the ammo trucks perform, not like it even matters.
Having designated vehicles to rescue lost crews? Hmmm, that's a fascinating idea, I don't know if I ever would have thought of it, but given that getting in the same hex with the crew, exposes the rescuer, is perhaps not worth it, but on the other hand, if the rescuer is support and the crew is core, that makes a lot of sense. I'm not one that's big on using smoke and certainly some smoke would help that situation considerably.
I used one of my special forces yesterday who was one level lower than the closest enemy, to put smoke between them instead of shooting it out (he'd already been ravaged pretty badly. And against a 19 man unit at that!!!). The hex I smoked, was the only possible hex that he could see my unit through, so there I am, using smoke only in such a ridiculous mismatch, and all it did was enable counterfire from that same enemy unit, thus knocking my unit beyond any hope of further fighting (Elevation must make a difference I suppose with smoke). I almost never use smoke, because it never seems to go away, and also because, though it may aid a unit in somewhat of a tough spot, all it does, from the way I play, is cover the enemy unit from future counterfire. If you're Gerry and love your tanks, as opposed to en masse infantry tactics (about the only strategy the Japanese can effectively use btw), smoke isn't exactly your friend. I usually even find a way to get around having to advance when taking objective hills in an assault, without having to resort to smoke. The smoker strategy guys, would sure need to try to pick tanks which came with the stuff (PZIV's for Gerry).
Seriously folks, though it seems the computer has endless amounts of artillery fire when they have it, though I've done it (but not in SPWAW), isn't it a huge ripoff for us to position artillery beside an ammo dump? Or at least it would be so if we knew the computer never does it, which I suspect it doesn't. Now IF the enemy ever counter-fired our artillery batteries, I would say it's fair. Hmmm. with some of the surprises I've seen in SPWAW, I have to wonder if the boys haven't actually set up a routine to do precisely that with the AI. I haven't used artillery other than 88's who I use mostly for direct fire anyway, so naturally they draw fire from artillery, but what about the rear area indirect fire stuff?
I used one of my special forces yesterday who was one level lower than the closest enemy, to put smoke between them instead of shooting it out (he'd already been ravaged pretty badly. And against a 19 man unit at that!!!). The hex I smoked, was the only possible hex that he could see my unit through, so there I am, using smoke only in such a ridiculous mismatch, and all it did was enable counterfire from that same enemy unit, thus knocking my unit beyond any hope of further fighting (Elevation must make a difference I suppose with smoke). I almost never use smoke, because it never seems to go away, and also because, though it may aid a unit in somewhat of a tough spot, all it does, from the way I play, is cover the enemy unit from future counterfire. If you're Gerry and love your tanks, as opposed to en masse infantry tactics (about the only strategy the Japanese can effectively use btw), smoke isn't exactly your friend. I usually even find a way to get around having to advance when taking objective hills in an assault, without having to resort to smoke. The smoker strategy guys, would sure need to try to pick tanks which came with the stuff (PZIV's for Gerry).
Seriously folks, though it seems the computer has endless amounts of artillery fire when they have it, though I've done it (but not in SPWAW), isn't it a huge ripoff for us to position artillery beside an ammo dump? Or at least it would be so if we knew the computer never does it, which I suspect it doesn't. Now IF the enemy ever counter-fired our artillery batteries, I would say it's fair. Hmmm. with some of the surprises I've seen in SPWAW, I have to wonder if the boys haven't actually set up a routine to do precisely that with the AI. I haven't used artillery other than 88's who I use mostly for direct fire anyway, so naturally they draw fire from artillery, but what about the rear area indirect fire stuff?
I used the jeep as an example for getting crews in trouble, maybe a poor one. APC's, armoured cars, light tanks might be better. This is going to sound cruel but...I would much rather lose a APC than a experianced tank crew and the APC crew still stands a chance of gettin out even if the track is destroyed.
I'm with you Charles22, I try not to use smoke to much. Kinda depends on the moment.
Here we disagree big time, however. If I can get it, and I've got it, I'm going to use it.
Keeping my arty going for the full battle is a high priority for me. I only regret I can't fix up the offboard with more ammo ( hint,hint,nudge,nudge). Speaking of which , would be nice to be able to order the offmap units to fire at the AI offmap units. I don't know yet if the AI will get around to shelling my onmap arty yet, doesn't seem to have a high priority.
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Hell On Wheels
I'm with you Charles22, I try not to use smoke to much. Kinda depends on the moment.
Here we disagree big time, however. If I can get it, and I've got it, I'm going to use it.
Keeping my arty going for the full battle is a high priority for me. I only regret I can't fix up the offboard with more ammo ( hint,hint,nudge,nudge). Speaking of which , would be nice to be able to order the offmap units to fire at the AI offmap units. I don't know yet if the AI will get around to shelling my onmap arty yet, doesn't seem to have a high priority.
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Hell On Wheels
PR
Pack Rat: Ah, yes... Sending in light tanks, armored cars, etc. The only problem is...that you are saving a tank crew. How is that a problem? Well, if what shot at your tank can still shoot, no matter what you send in there could get destroyed as well (It destroyed a tank didn't it?). The only thing that would have a ghost of a chance, would be something fast, and small enough to hopefully load and not be hit. My primemovers don't have a very easy time moving 88's to safety, because the bombardment that hits around the guns causes so much cratering, that manuever is much more limited. This of course is working around the PM's having to be far enough from the guns to not be hit alongside, and then load and carry the guns a good distance from where the shells are falling.
Hi Charles22,
Yeah I know what you're saying and you're right, what ever got the tank is still there.
Ideally you'd have spotted the unit that killed the tank and lay down surpression fire and have something fast near by. It all really depends on the situation. But mainly what I'm speaking of is getting the crew well to the rear in the fastest manner possable. It may take a turn or two to do it but it's well worth the effort to save valuable crews. If you can get them back to the retreat hex you can get them completly off the map
Speaking of crews, I've noticed on the upgrade board there are two types. One has pistils the other submachine guns. Is it possable to upgrade the crews from pistils to subs before we remount them to their respective tanks?
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Good hunting,
Pack Rat
Yeah I know what you're saying and you're right, what ever got the tank is still there.
Ideally you'd have spotted the unit that killed the tank and lay down surpression fire and have something fast near by. It all really depends on the situation. But mainly what I'm speaking of is getting the crew well to the rear in the fastest manner possable. It may take a turn or two to do it but it's well worth the effort to save valuable crews. If you can get them back to the retreat hex you can get them completly off the map
Speaking of crews, I've noticed on the upgrade board there are two types. One has pistils the other submachine guns. Is it possable to upgrade the crews from pistils to subs before we remount them to their respective tanks?
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Good hunting,
Pack Rat
PR