MWiF Map Review - Pacific Islands

[Froonp]

Here are the Hawaiian Islands, without the coastlines done, and with relatively few names on it.
Difficult to tell if it is done OK or not.

[Froonp]

Here are the same Hawaiian Islands with the coastlines added, by me, not the graphic artist, so this might not be the same in the final game. I just add them to see the map clearer and see the flaws better. And for fun too, I like doing this [:D].
I also added the most names I could gather, to be able to recognise the place on actual maps.

Edit : This is a reduced picture, I work on a larger one. I made screenshots of all the map, and created a complete map of the full MWiF map. It was great fun to do this !

Edit : I know I made the islands to small, and thus the terrain is difficult to dinstinguish.

[trees trees]

I think some of those 'shoals' and 'rocks' might be a bit small to have any military significance, i.e. long enough to build an airstrip on? It seems there are more land hexes now between Pearl and Midway?

I think in WiF it is important to draw the sea boundaries into the port symbols to clearly show which sea zones are connected to which ports.

[Froonp]

ORIGINAL: trees trees

I think some of those 'shoals' and 'rocks' might be a bit small to have any military significance, i.e. long enough to build an airstrip on? It seems there are more land hexes now between Pearl and Midway?

Distances are magnified by a 2,6 factor, so new land hexes are normal.

I think in WiF it is important to draw the sea boundaries into the port symbols to clearly show which sea zones are connected to which ports.

The rule in WiF FE is that the position of the port in the hex doesn't matter. If the Sea Zone boundary intercects the hex, then the port has access to both sea zones.

[trees trees]

I looked at my paper maps and there were originally five other hexes between Pearl and Midway, one of which was the now three hex group aroud Kauai now. I understand that as the scale goes up more land will appear. But I think there were geographical reasons and limits why there was a base on Midway and not on the other islands. Are you really sure all those bits of land have potential military use? Most any island big enough to build an airstrip was considered in planning by both sides. And of course only some islands had enough space say for a B-29 runway. But in WiF any hex will do. It will really make no difference to strategy or play if there are ten hexes between Pearl and Midway or only five of them. Now what I'm getting at is if all the beautiful hi-res coastline bitmapping is eating up computing power and loading time, perhaps some savings could be generated by eliminating places with names like "shoal"?

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: trees trees

I looked at my paper maps and there were originally five other hexes between Pearl and Midway, one of which was the now three hex group aroud Kauai now. I understand that as the scale goes up more land will appear. But I think there were geographical reasons and limits why there was a base on Midway and not on the other islands. Are you really sure all those bits of land have potential military use? Most any island big enough to build an airstrip was considered in planning by both sides. And of course only some islands had enough space say for a B-29 runway. But in WiF any hex will do. It will really make no difference to strategy or play if there are ten hexes between Pearl and Midway or only five of them. Now what I'm getting at is if all the beautiful hi-res coastline bitmapping is eating up computing power and loading time, perhaps some savings could be generated by eliminating places with names like "shoal"?

When counting coastal hex bitmaps I am already assuming that there will be a myriad of hexes that use a generic 'island' hex bitmap. There might be several of different sizes (tiny, itsy bitsy, teeny weeny, smallish, shoal enough). Don't worry about that stuff, I have that worrying well covered already.

Your points about their effect on gameplay are more interesting, and valid concerns.

[trees trees]

maybe you can head out on the ocean and do some up-close 'research' of your home area of the map. [8D]

there are so many hexes to choose from even at Pacific scale that adding more islands won't make too much difference. perhaps the ones within bombing range of Japan, where land is a bit more scarce, should be added with care. what US player wouldn't want to see more hexes in the North Temperate zone in the Bonins?

[Neilster]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

When counting coastal hex bitmaps I am already assuming that there will be a myriad of hexes that use a generic 'island' hex bitmap. There might be several of different sizes (tiny, itsy bitsy, teeny weeny, smallish, shoal enough).

You could have an itsy-bitsy, teeny-weeny, yellow polka-dot Bikini Atoll. [:'(]

Cheers, Neilster

[SurrenderMonkey]

Definitely to many usable islands between Hawaii and Midway, IMHO. Take a look at the WitP map - I think the only usable piece of ground is French Frigate Shoals, and it is extremely marginal at best. Johnston Island is due west, and much more viable. What's that west of Midway, between Midway and Wake?

[Anendrue]

The problem in island hopping and selection during wwii seems to be a bit oversimplified. For example an airstrip may be built but how is it supplied, by air or sea? Is there a port and if not  is the island capable of handling small seacraft landing supplies?
 
Since we should not change the WiF rules and we do not want to unbalance game play (think China problems) adding more land could very quickly unbalance game play.
 
If islands are added for asthetics then great. So I propose the road which allows for traditional game play with asthetic only land masses for islands. Perhaps a grey island could be an unusable land mass but will be there for good looking maps. This way we leave the same amount of islands and their original use as defined in WiF.
 
 
 
 
 
 

[Froonp]

ORIGINAL: trees trees

I looked at my paper maps and there were originally five other hexes between Pearl and Midway, one of which was the now three hex group aroud Kauai now. I understand that as the scale goes up more land will appear. But I think there were geographical reasons and limits why there was a base on Midway and not on the other islands.

Midway has a minor port;so can stack more planes. Moreover, Midway is placed at the intersection of 3 Sea Areas, and is in supply from Pearl through the Hawaiian Island Sea Area. One CP is sufficient to keep it in supply, and the Hawaiian Sea Area is easy to escort from Pearl, ensuring a fair chance of staying is supply. Kure for example has nothing of those. It is hard to supply, hard to escort the supply ships, low stacking, with no port.
In WWII, we know that the US had bases at Midway. But what do we know of which bases they could have built on any other Hawaiian island chain, if the need had arrised, if the Japanese had taken Midway for example, and were threatening Pearl Harbor ???
The WiF FE game has to leave this open to the player.

I would add that this map is the map how Harry would have liked it, if space constrains were not existing for the paper game.

Also, having taken measurements on this map, it is a lot more accurate than the WiF FE one, that has to abstract some details because of the scale.

Bottom line is that I'm in favor of reviewing the map to remove blattant flaws, but I'm against making the Pacific part of the map a simple magnified out version of the WiF FE map, with exactly the same number of land hexes in the seas. Having played CWiF a lot, and in the Pacific too, believe me there is no problem with the "extra bases". Thoses "extra" land hexes are here for both belligerents, and they are faithfull to Geography.

This said, I begun reviewing the Caroline Islands, but I've got troubles finding maps showing enough details.

[lomyrin]

I also find the present map and the Islands it contains in the Pacific very good and I do not think it should be changed.

Having played a lot of CWiF with the same map, it works very well for both Japan and the USA and much Island hopping usually takes place in order to get bases for land based air which then enables placing pressure on the other side.

As far as Islands go in the Pacific, the navigation maps even in the mid 50's were not all that complete and a many small Islands were either not on the maps or noted as 'reported by USS xxx in 1952 to be 15 miles NW of the printed location etc.

This is real, I was there on merchant ships at the time.

Lars

[Froonp]

I made improvements on the map (didn't change anything from the MWiF map).
I made the Sea Zone boundaries a little longer, to experiment what it could look like. They are not as long as what Steve has told, but a little longer.
I also made the islands a little larger, because the terrain didn't show very well.
I believe that with those sizes, the terrain shows quite well.
Also, I marked as unknown an island that that lies 10 hexes (about 800 miles) north from Oahu. I can't find it in any map. The MWiF map has it being part of the Hawaiian Islands Territory.

I believe that any island like this one that are unfound on real maps should be deleted. It seems they do not exist.
So, if someone knows this island, please tell me what it is.

[trees trees]

ORIGINAL: abj9562

The problem in island hopping and selection during wwii seems to be a bit oversimplified. For example an airstrip may be built but how is it supplied, by air or sea? Is there a port and if not  is the island capable of handling small seacraft landing supplies?

This is more what I was trying to think about, you are right. Thus Tarawa got an airstrip and other nearby places didn't, because it had a pier you could unload a regular merchant ship on (been awhile since reading up on this), thus it's port symbol in WiF. And of course never underestimate what the CBs could do. But I don't think either side ran into any limits as far as finding usable airbases until the Americans wanted to launch heavy bombers against Japan. Adding hexes shouldn't matter too much in the South Pacific; I'd be more careful where they are already scarce, like Hawaii and the Bonins.

[lomyrin]

I never questioned that island by itself north of Oahu in CWiF but after Patrice pointed out that it is something unknown and questionable I believe it does indeed not exist. There is an undersea 'Musicians Seamount' chain in that area but I also have not found any evidence that an Island actually exists there.

Lars

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: lomyrin
I never questioned that island by itself north of Oahu in CWiF but after Patrice pointed out that it is something unknown and questionable I believe it does indeed not exist. There is an undersea 'Musicians Seamount' chain in that area but I also have not found any evidence that an Island actually exists there.

Lars

Obviously it was reported by the same guy who reported there were mermaids luring sailors into the sea by playing lyres.

Most likely this island exists on the map because of a typo on the row and/or column number for the hex.

[Froonp]

This is how the Carolines look.
Some notes about it :

- Ujalang is part of the Marshalls, not the Carolines Islands.

- I would move Gaferut 1 hex West.
- I would delete the 3 Islands West of Faraulep / Italik / Woleai / Eauripik. Did not find it on the maps, or I placed the whole western Carolines wrongly.
- I would delete the Island south of Mokil / Pingelap. Did not find it on the maps.

Note : The most western Carolines Islands (Yap Islands) are covered in the Palau Islands part (next). MWiF had them (wrongly ???) belonging to the Palau Islands Territory.

[Froonp]

Here is how they look in WiF FE

[Froonp]

Here are what the Palau Islands look.
No changes are proposed here.

[Froonp]

Here is what the Palau look like in WiF FE