Bug or am I crazy?

[Misconduct]

ORIGINAL: John Lansford
As far as major warships not sinking from one torpedo hit, the captains of Kongo and Taiho would like to disagree with you.

I just read the story on the kongo, pretty interesting never the less. My arguement in another forum posted Japanese terrible damage control shows in this incident also. Two torps hit the side of Kongo, but the Captain deciding to go full speed caused even more problems in the terrible weather. To say this was perfect example a Torp doing the most damage in a wartime condition, Seas rough and careless damage control helped Kongo sink rather then effects of just 2 torp hits and she escapes.

I believe it was a factor in what made the Kongo sink, if it were clear skies and no chop I am sure she'd made it away just fine, possibly. This was just a lucky shot that because sealion being on radar, caused the skipper to brown his pants and run away causing more problems.

I do agree with you though don't get me wrong John, a Torp hit under magazine would be enough to blow any battleship out of the water regardless of its size. Granted Yamato had more armor it was able to withstand that kind of attack, however like Tiger Tanks and Me-262's - Yamato was so few built and did nothing to win the war.

[bradfordkay]

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

Day Air attack on TF at 44,63


Allied aircraft
F4U-1D Corsair x 24
P-38J Lightning x 156
PB4Y Liberator x 48
B-24J Liberator x 178


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 7 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed, 9 damaged

Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Bomb hits 36, on fire
BB Musashi, Bomb hits 23, on fire

Exactly why I refuse to play a game where 4E bombers are allowed on naval attack.

As long as the Japanese player has his long ranged torpedo bombers to rule the seas, the allied player should get some sort of response...

I limit my 4E bomber naval attacks, but would never play a game that prevents them entirely - unless it prevents 2E torpedo bomber attacks as well.

[Ketza]

I once hit the POW with over 40 bombs from Anns and Sonias and it got away. There must not have been much left on the deck after all that.

[Misconduct]

I appreciate everyones response to my post, lets me know that 100 bombs doesn't mean the ship is sunk, I did manage to catch Musashi at Turk and sank her with 13 bomb hits and 7 torp hits.

[Barb]

I had recently blow up Hiei by one dutch torpedo. Magazine explosion. That firework at Batavia must have be able to see from Soerebaya [:D]

[Ken Estes]

Another flaw with aerial bombing of waships is that hits are recorded frequently against belt armor, which also adds unreasonably to Shokaku and other survival rates, although Zuikaku absorbed a lot of punishment before going down, incl surface ship fire. The CAs in particular take many bomb hits on belt armor, making them tougher than their historical condition.

[Jim D Burns]

ORIGINAL: herwin
She also had closed hangars, which seriously aggravated the effect of bomb hits. The kill mechanisms for IJN carrier casualties were uncontrollable fires or flooding, not bomb damage.

Also the allied CVs usually flooded their aviation gas systems with carbon dioxide before an incoming strike arrived, thus their fuel wasn't prone to ignite as easily as the Japanese carriers fuel did. Without a source of oxygen to mix with the gas fumes in the empty spaces of the tanks, there were no dangerous fume pockets to ignite unless a tank or line was ruptured first to allow oxygen in.

Jim

[castor troy]

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

Day Air attack on TF at 44,63


Allied aircraft
F4U-1D Corsair x 24
P-38J Lightning x 156
PB4Y Liberator x 48
B-24J Liberator x 178


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 7 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed, 9 damaged

Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Bomb hits 36, on fire
BB Musashi, Bomb hits 23, on fire

Exactly why I refuse to play a game where 4E bombers are allowed on naval attack.

pretty much my thinking but what do I do with all my torpedoe carrying Nells and Betties when playing the Japanese? They are so overrated in anti shipping strikes (due to the torp availability) that 4Es on nav attack compensate that somehow. Of course I would always prefer 100 B-24 over 100 Betties because you can use the 4Es also for something else than nav strikes and everything but a BB can be sunk by B-24s. IJN CAs are dead meat if being attacked by B-24s when they drop 3 1000lb bombs each, as those babies penetrate the deck armor. Not to talk about the 2000lb bombs.

[castor troy]

ORIGINAL: John Lansford

But, I've seen 1000 lb AP bombs result in no penetrations on both IJN CA's and non-Yamato class BB's, to the point that only the sheer weight of ordinance hitting accomplished anything, not that they were penetrating and doing actual damage.  The rare 2000 lb bombs carried by LBA were so infrequent I can't remember when or if any of them were actually used against warships.  Merchant ships yes, especially around Rabaul, but not warships IIRC.

don´t know about what mod you are playing (probably a very bad one) but in stock, Nikmod, bigB you surely haven´t seen 1000lb AP bombs NOT penetrating IJN CA armor, no matter what CA it was. [:-]

[castor troy]

ORIGINAL: Misconduct

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

I have lost BBs to single torp hits. It is all a die roll

Thats terrible, I can understand however a hit to a magazine would blow a BB in half, Perfect example of Die roll would be just now my 4th turn I had the SS Seawolf put 4 torps into an AK and it did not sink, the Tuna puts single torp into a Tanker and it sinks. Its possible the game mechanics are accurate, as the 4 torps did not hit anything vital, yet the one into tanker could of hit a vital area.

I guess in WITP everything can happen but an AK not sinking after 4 torp hits is either FOW (the hits, or the sinking) or it happens only one out of 1.000.000.000.000.000.000.000 times...

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: castor troy

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

ORIGINAL: RUPD3658

Day Air attack on TF at 44,63


Allied aircraft
F4U-1D Corsair x 24
P-38J Lightning x 156
PB4Y Liberator x 48
B-24J Liberator x 178


Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 7 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed, 9 damaged

Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Bomb hits 36, on fire
BB Musashi, Bomb hits 23, on fire

Exactly why I refuse to play a game where 4E bombers are allowed on naval attack.

pretty much my thinking but what do I do with all my torpedoe carrying Nells and Betties when playing the Japanese? They are so overrated in anti shipping strikes (due to the torp availability) that 4Es on nav attack compensate that somehow. Of course I would always prefer 100 B-24 over 100 Betties because you can use the 4Es also for something else than nav strikes and everything but a BB can be sunk by B-24s. IJN CAs are dead meat if being attacked by B-24s when they drop 3 1000lb bombs each, as those babies penetrate the deck armor. Not to talk about the 2000lb bombs.

Science fantasy--I just watched 200 4E bombers at high altitude obliterate a bunch of ships anchored in Kwajalein lagoon. Of course it was hit next by SBDs and TBFs, but the 4E bombers hadn't left much to sink. If you know anything about Kwaj (lagoon area of 2174 km²), that sort of outcome is fantasy.