Long Tom Accuracy

[mike scholl 1]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

If you want a really big gun, try this one: http://www.vincelewis.net/dora.html

Big yes..., but a touch light on the Mobility Factor... [:D]

[morganbj]

Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

[mike scholl 1]

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan

Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

I'll put my money on the 8" Howitzer.

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan

Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

At what range?

AIR the 8" howitzer at comparable ranges.

[JWE]

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan
Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

Aw, c'mon dude, it's all CEP for a tube, and I know they taught that stuff to FOs. All depends on the tube design, the charge increment and how good the Met pukes were at HQ Bty. M113 could really reach out and touch someone The M115 just wasn't in it. Just take a peek at the CEP tables at base charge. Not that accuracy means anything, when a smaller CEP and smaller boom is equated to a bigger CEP and bigger boom. Just reach back and remember the stuff they taught you at Ft Sill, or if you didn't get to Sill, what the Yankee fools at Devins were trying to teach (if they could ever find their butts with their left hands).

M113, hands down.

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: JWE

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan
Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

Aw, c'mon dude, it's all CEP for a tube, and I know they taught that stuff to FOs. All depends on the tube design, the charge increment and how good the Met pukes were at HQ Bty. M113 could really reach out and touch someone The M115 just wasn't in it. Just take a peek at the CEP tables at base charge. Not that accuracy means anything, when a smaller CEP and smaller boom is equated to a bigger CEP and bigger boom. Just reach back and remember the stuff they taught you at Ft Sill, or if you didn't get to Sill, what the Yankee fools at Devins were trying to teach (if they could ever find their butts with their left hands).

M113, hands down.

Weren't the M107 and M110 about the same?

[Fallschirmjager]

ORIGINAL: Gilbert

It descended from a heavy gun used in the French Army.

This gun was the 155mm GPF (Grande Puissance Filloux). More details here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_de_155mm_GPF

Gilbert

Ask my opponent DivePac88 about these guns in the PI [:D]

[Fallschirmjager]

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan

Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

I have read that when the war in Italy slowed down to a snail like pace that the Allies used the 8" gun as a 'sniper' piece being able to pick off single buildings and strong points in just a handful of shots.

[Blackhorse]

There are a slew of US 155mm-equipped units in AE, but only a few should be using the Long Toms.

Most Army and Marine Divisions and separate artillery battalions have (or eventually get) the (device 1160) M1 Howitzer. Late war reinforcements from the ETO bring the (1167) M12 GMC, the self-propelled version of the M1 Howitzer. These 155's have an accuracy of '4'.

The US Army Coastal Artillery bns/rgts and the Marine defense battalions have (or upgrade to) the M1918 GPF and its modernized succesor, the M1A1 GPF. These are 155mm guns, not howitzers, on the rotating "Panama Mounts" that Mike Scholl mentioned that makes them effective versus ships. Their accuracy is 50 and 53 respectively.

IIRC, the only Long Tom-equipped (device 1161) units in the game should be about half of the dozen or so independent Marine artillery battalions. (The other half have 155mm howitzers). They each have only 12 tubes. These are the same M1A1 guns that the coastal defense battalions have, but we assume that the battalions are not as rigorously trained in engaging ships as are the defense battalions, and/or that not all of the guns have Panama Mounts and the associated tracking equipment, so the accuracy has been reduced to '25'. The primary role of the Long Tom battalions was to serve as Corps-artillery equivalent support for Marine grunts. But they were expected to be able to engage ships, as well.

Is your concern solely with the effect the Long Tom units are having during land combat, or is it bombardment effect of the other 155mm gun LCUs (like the Coastal Artillery regiments)?

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: Blackhorse


...Is your concern solely with the effect the Long Tom units are having during land combat, or is it bombardment effect of the other 155mm gun LCUs (like the Coastal Artillery regiments)?

Initially I was on the receiving end of Long Tom barrage, went into the db to see how/why I got my butt kicked. [;)]

Noted the range and accuracy of the device were the same (25), and that the accuracy was substantually higher than similar pieces. Wasn't sure if this was WAD or a typo.

Thanks for stepping in and clarifying.

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan

Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

I have read that when the war in Italy slowed down to a snail like pace that the Allies used the 8" gun as a 'sniper' piece being able to pick off single buildings and strong points in just a handful of shots.

Precision fire. The 8" howitzer and the 175mm gun were close in accuracy--the 175 was about 10% better. The 8" howitzer was about 5% more accurate in most missions according to the manuals.

[morganbj]

ORIGINAL: herwin

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan

Speaking of accuracy, as a one time Vietnam Era artillery forward observer I posit this question, which was more accurate, the 8" howitzer (towed or SP, no difference) or the 175MM gun?

I have read that when the war in Italy slowed down to a snail like pace that the Allies used the 8" gun as a 'sniper' piece being able to pick off single buildings and strong points in just a handful of shots.

Precision fire. The 8" howitzer and the 175mm gun were close in accuracy--the 175 was about 10% better. The 8" howitzer was about 5% more accurate in most missions according to the manuals.

The 8" was MUCH more accurate. We could put an 8" round within a few feet of a point target perhaps 80-90% of the time once we had properly registered the target. The 175 was never able to get that close. If you got within 30 meters, you were lucky.

But, the 175 seemed to have a much larger burst radius, so precision accuaracy wasn't as important. I saw target effect as much as 80-90m to either side of the burst with a 175. The 8" seed to be less, perhaps 40-50 meters or so. What do the manuals say about burst radius?

[herwin]

ORIGINAL: bjmorgan

ORIGINAL: herwin

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager




I have read that when the war in Italy slowed down to a snail like pace that the Allies used the 8" gun as a 'sniper' piece being able to pick off single buildings and strong points in just a handful of shots.

Precision fire. The 8" howitzer and the 175mm gun were close in accuracy--the 175 was about 10% better. The 8" howitzer was about 5% more accurate in most missions according to the manuals.

The 8" was MUCH more accurate. We could put an 8" round within a few feet of a point target perhaps 80-90% of the time once we had properly registered the target. The 175 was never able to get that close. If you got within 30 meters, you were lucky.

But, the 175 seemed to have a much larger burst radius, so precision accuaracy wasn't as important. I saw target effect as much as 80-90m to either side of the burst with a 175. The 8" seed to be less, perhaps 40-50 meters or so. What do the manuals say about burst radius?

See this link.