SPwaw OOB Feedback

[KG Erwin]

This is really nitpicking, but in the early part of the war, the armored car allocation for certain regiments/battalions in the GE OOB should be 4 20mm (Sdkfz 222 or 231/8) and 4 Sdkfz 221s. I got around this by creating a le PSW grp in formation slot 1171 of the German OOB, available from Jan 1937 to 1949, and weapons being two Sdkfz 221. In this way, you can realistically recreate the Aufklarungs Abt attached to your kampfgruppe if you're playing a long campaign as the Germans starting in 1939 or earlier. The slot was available, so why not use it? There were so many different iterations of the German recon units that recreating one for a particular time frame is difficult, but this is an option for the early war period. I have more info on early-war German PSW platoons/battalions if needed.

[V-man]

Originally posted by BryanMelvin
Can anyone chime in on current version 7.1 OOBa and let me know if you have seen any Formation oddities as well as imput on Formations, Weapons, etc..

In the works are a new set of OOBs due for release soon from Matrix. Many of the issues and errors of 7.1 oobs have been corrected.

I would like to hear from anyone on 7.1 oobs so that I can recheck the new ones to see if I missed anything.

<snip>

as well as any imput on other Nation's oobs

Well, let's talk about ammo cannisters for Airborne use - the US and Germans simply don't get any, Norway's is available sometime in 1949. I recommend they have a crew of "0", weight of "1". I recommend that all airborne troops be given a carry of "1".
This will allow airborne resupply or at least small firefights as part of a larger battle to recover cannisters dropped away from the units that need them. I'd give Rangers and Commandoes that Carry of "1" as well. Those guys carried so much ammo with them into combat...

Also, when buying German units in June of 44, i ahve a problem. there are SO MANY units on the MISC screen, I can't buy mines. Many of them are Recon, howsabout moving them to the Armor screen?

And the carry/weights of Command Cars and HQ units is off. Some can't carry the HQ squad. Jeeps should be able to carry a US commander, but I need a halftrack!

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by KG Erwin
This is really nitpicking, but in the early part of the war, the armored car allocation for certain regiments/battalions in the GE OOB should be 4 20mm (Sdkfz 222 or 231/8) and 4 Sdkfz 221s. I got around this by creating a le PSW grp in formation slot 1171 of the German OOB, available from Jan 1937 to 1949, and weapons being two Sdkfz 221. In this way, you can realistically recreate the Aufklarungs Abt attached to your kampfgruppe if you're playing a long campaign as the Germans starting in 1939 or earlier. The slot was available, so why not use it? There were so many different iterations of the German recon units that recreating one for a particular time frame is difficult, but this is an option for the early war period. I have more info on early-war German PSW platoons/battalions if needed.

This was done before you asked

All I did was make the sections consist of two units. Also, you can post any info on these units here this would help immensely

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by V-man
Well, let's talk about ammo cannisters for Airborne use - the US and Germans simply don't get any, Norway's is available sometime in 1949. I recommend they have a crew of "0", weight of "1". I recommend that all airborne troops be given a carry of "1".
This will allow airborne resupply or at least small firefights as part of a larger battle to recover cannisters dropped away from the units that need them. I'd give Rangers and Commandoes that Carry of "1" as well. Those guys carried so much ammo with them into combat...

Also, when buying German units in June of 44, i ahve a problem. there are SO MANY units on the MISC screen, I can't buy mines. Many of them are Recon, howsabout moving them to the Armor screen?

And the carry/weights of Command Cars and HQ units is off. Some can't carry the HQ squad. Jeeps should be able to carry a US commander, but I need a halftrack!

I cannot move the ammo cannister around. It is found in Norway Dec 1949 editor menu and it is used as a design tool for scenarios. The reason why it is crewed is so that it will not appear on map as destroyed if uncrewed (spwaw system).

As for jeeps and command cars - I'll check these out.

[V-man]

Originally posted by BryanMelvin
I cannot move the ammo cannister around. It is found in Norway Dec 1949 editor menu and it is used as a design tool for scenarios. The reason why it is crewed is so that it will not appear on map as destroyed if uncrewed (spwaw system).

I don't understand why it can't be repeated in other nation's OOBs - I've already done this, but the issue is that folks I play online don't have my OOBs and aren't in a big rush to change thiers.


I understand teh crew issue, but simply having a US Army and a German and a British, (etc) ammo cannister shouldn't be a big deal. Sorry to sound snide, but since I've added it to my OOBs, I just want to know why it can't go in offically, as it were.

[KG Erwin]

I came across some detailed German KStN charts at Christoph Awender's excellent site: http://www.wwiidaybyday.com/ I thought it better to refer you to the site rather than my posting info which was partially derived from it. Btw, I'm putting my latest German-language OOB70 on the SPWaW OOB Mod sub-forum: using info derived from Panzer Leo's H2H mod and elsewhere, all German units/formations now have German designations. Maybe you can use some of that for adoption into the "official" OOB.

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by V-man
I don't understand why it can't be repeated in other nation's OOBs - I've already done this, but the issue is that folks I play online don't have my OOBs and aren't in a big rush to change thiers.


I understand teh crew issue, but simply having a US Army and a German and a British, (etc) ammo cannister shouldn't be a big deal. Sorry to sound snide, but since I've added it to my OOBs, I just want to know why it can't go in offically, as it were.

When you design a scenario using new oob and play using it - all will be fine. However, many players will not download the new oobs and will be playing a scenario deigned with new oobs and use the old 7.1 oobs, thus, weapon data errors occur.

[o4r]

Originally posted by BryanMelvin
Thanks Or4 and Ruxius,

I'll look into the weapon size thing and see what this is and see about the units too

Thanks but I also found out from the old data that, the game initially set the armour data for only the hull or the turret.

So if the tank is a SP, the superstructure automatically become the turret and hull armour will still remain.

Now, If the said vehicle does not have a turret and anyone set the reading to 0 for all, the vehicle even if it has 100 mm armour rating for all side, any hit on the turret destroyed the vehicle.

However, later changing of data from SPWAW was done by Pople who really know about armour. So they replace the turret armour by superstructural armour rating. Which is more correct due to the fact you can never hit the turret anymore but you will definitly hit it hull or superstructure.

So vehicle I managed does not have a turret and even though it is armour, one hit from an infantry will sure destory with a pistol.

SdKfz 252 LGM armour rating on the turret should be based on the superstructure and the Mobelwagen should be based on it shield rating rather than superstructure.

SdKfz 252 LGM armour rating should be as followed:

Superstructure Front 18/30 deg, Side 8/30 deg, Rear 8/55 deg and it also had a covered which is 8/30 deg. (This rating should replace it turret)

Hull Front 18/12 deg, Side 8/30 deg, Rear 8/45 deg.

It is armed like the Sd Kfz 253 Beob with a MG 34 and acutally in hsitory both vehicle are the same type of vehicle, their armour rating is in fact the same.

The data in the game for Sd Kfz 253 Beob is different maybe someone is reflecting that during 1942 onwards, German industrial is actually struggling to increase their output as such only related tanks Like Pz 3 and 4 are hardened and the rest of the vehicle etc are normally steel plates.... maybe... just a guess for the different armour rating.

[V-man]

Originally posted by BryanMelvin
When you design a scenario using new oob and play using it - all will be fine. However, many players will not download the new oobs and will be playing a scenario deigned with new oobs and use the old 7.1 oobs, thus, weapon data errors occur.

uhm, yes, I understood that. My question was: Why can't the ammo cannisters be put into each nation, in the appropriate period, *officially*? You are saying it cannot be done, I'm just asking why.

[mogami]

Hi, Bulgarian trucks display ship icon.
Italian motorized infantry display truck icon.

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by Mogami
Hi, Bulgarian trucks display ship icon.
Italian motorized infantry display truck icon.

This has now been fixed - please keep the reports rolling in

[ruxius]

Hello Brian, I was inspecting about Radio values..
I found there is an high range of variability for radio values...

I am going to think there should be a sort of overall review

Radio Values Ex:
Gurkha Rifles: 70
BR Commandos: 90
GAP Saboteurs: 12
FR Maquis: 10
IT Askari: 0
GE Rifle Sqd:10
GE SS Rifle Sqd: 11
IN Rifle Sec: 60 (India OOB)
GE FJ Airborne: 11
GE Engineer : 21
SO Conscripts: 20
SO Rifle: 10
SO Guard Inf: 20
SO Engineer : 10 (slot#120)
SO Engineer: 20 (slot#121)


Manual says first number indicates percentage chance fo ra unit to have radio...second cipher regards rarity factor...
can you confirm this...?

but can you help me understand values for classes of units ?
Is there a standard base reference ?

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by ruxius
Hello Brian, I was inspecting about Radio values..
I found there is an high range of variability for radio values...

I am going to think there should be a sort of overall review

Radio Values Ex:
Gurkha Rifles: 70
BR Commandos: 90
GAP Saboteurs: 12
FR Maquis: 10
IT Askari: 0
GE Rifle Sqd:10
GE SS Rifle Sqd: 11
IN Rifle Sec: 60 (India OOB)
GE FJ Airborne: 11
GE Engineer : 21
SO Conscripts: 20
SO Rifle: 10
SO Guard Inf: 20
SO Engineer : 10 (slot#120)
SO Engineer: 20 (slot#121)


Manual says first number indicates percentage chance fo ra unit to have radio...second cipher regards rarity factor...
can you confirm this...?

but can you help me understand values for classes of units ?
Is there a standard base reference ?

Yes - that is correct. The USSR 50 mortars will not all come with radios for that Radio deprived nation in WWII era!

[ruxius]

Go on checking all over around...noticed:



General modification: Changing UNIT CLASS
From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun but also other
minor changes




ANZAC----------------------------------
#129 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun


BULGARIA ----------------------------------
#007 Change Name and Class 8mm Madsen - > NAme 8mm MAdsen HMG BULGARIA

#33 (comparing with Autoblinda #40 all data are similar and LBM is the same)(also unit is slightly underrated but that is correct since cost is lower )
I suggest:
Name Fiat -> Fiat AB40
Thick FH 9 - > 15 Skirts: 0 - > 25

(again this unit is copied from IT OOB also Enctxt and LBM are the same )
#39 NAme : Ansaldo-Fiat -> Fiat CL-33

CANADA----------------------------------
#90 Class 51 - Light Infantry -> 04 - Machine Gun
#92 Class From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

CZECH----------------------------------
#175 Class From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun


FINLAND ----------------------------------
(please check as I found Finns had released a new OOB )
#111 Class From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#241 Class From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#242 Class From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#243 Class From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

#121 Name : 7.62mm DS39 HMG - > 7.62mm MMG
#244 same

FRANCE----------------------------------
#92 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

FREE FRANCE----------------------------------
#141 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#143 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

HUNGARY----------------------------------
#74 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#107 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#108 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun


GREEK ----------------------------------
(same correction will be done inside ITALIAN OOBs this is a cut & paste error)
#34 Name 8mm Breda MMG -> 8mm Breda HMG
#34 Class 04- MachineGun - > 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#35 Class 04- MachineGun - > 81 - Heavy Machine Gun


INDIA----------------------------------
#129 Class 04- MachineGun - > 81 - Heavy Machine Gun


NETHERLANDS----------------------------------
#23 Class 04- MachineGun - > 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#24 Class 04- MachineGun - > 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

NORWAY----------------------------------
(MANY SPECIAL UNITS have starting availability from 1949...is that
correct ..could they be used inside the game editor while creating
scenarios ? )
#105 are you sure 7073 is the correct LBM
#109 again LBM 9905 is the right one ? Unit is class CS-tank and name is Panzerturm
#208 Name From HMG Section to AAMG Section
LBMs from 1999 to 2008 are referred but does not exist

PHILIPPINES----------------------------------
#32 Comparing unit data with #167 FROM US Army OOB I would change it's name from MMG to HMG
#47 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#52 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#99 Name from GMC CCKW HMG to GMC CCKW AAMG

POLAND ----------------------------------
#49 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#50 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#165 Name from PF-508/518 HMG to PF-508/518 AAMG
#205 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

NATIONALIST SPAIN----------------------------------
#008 Name....not persuated about AAA since no AA weapon..compared to REPUBBLICAN SPAIN units#6 #7
#132 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#133 Name change from 7.92mm MG34 HMG to MMG
#142 Name change from Hotchkiss HMG to 7.5mm FM29 LMG

UK ----------------------------------
#97 Name from Maxim AA-Gun to Maxim AAMG
#162 Class from 51 - Light infantry to 04 - Machine Gun

US ARMY ----------------------------------
#167 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

YUGOSLAVIA ----------------------------------
#32 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#33 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun
#34 Class from 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by ruxius
Go on checking all over around...noticed:



General modification: Changing UNIT CLASS
From 04 - Machine Gun to 81 - Heavy Machine Gun but also other
minor changes................
..................
- Heavy Machine Gun

Yes - changes have been made Thanks for the details!!!!

[Alby]

I have never seen the Soviet 107MM Mortar available for purchase, with rarity turned on.
it is and has always been RED in every game i have played
could you look into this.
Thanks

[o4r]

Originally posted by Alby
I have never seen the Soviet 107MM Mortar available for purchase, with rarity turned on.
it is and has always been RED in every game i have played
could you look into this.
Thanks

Well you certain had a very bad luck game for that to happen but the most common to use was acutally the 120 mm mortar. The German capture so many that they used it too. There is actually one more country that was not mentioned much in the war, they were the Finland. They captured alot and also put them in used. But rarely 107 was mentioned much.

Actually our SPWAW actually text reading. I actually had the program like Fine reader Pro which allow me to convert text from scan. Sometime reading all these give you alot of fun but since no request from the administrator so nothing done. If we could all given a task by the admin to do something for the game like the text or get new picture for it rather some old stupid picture from old WWII photographs which kept repeating itself. We all can make a different and be proud that at least one part of it is done by us though not big but at least we did something inside.

ok, one of them I read was funny. It is about the Japanese 50 mm Type 89 Gernade discharger or in our SPWAW it was called 50 m T89 Mtr which meant mortar.

Well this was normally carried strapped to the soldier's leg and was therefore known to the as the "Leg Mortar". Unfortunately an Allied interpreter got it wrong and called it the "Knee Mortar", after which several people went to hospital with broken thighs after fitting the curved spade on to their legs and firing the mortar. Funny .....??

Further to the descrption of the weapon:
It was an unusual weapon in that it used a fixed elevation and the range was varied by screwing a rod up into the barrel so causing the bomb to fired higher up from the breech. That meant more space for the gas to expand and before it started the bomb on its way, and thus gave range control. As well as finned bomb, it could also fire standard hand grenade though to a much shorter range than proper bomb,

Each equipment weigh about 4,53 kg and weigh of shell is about 0.8 kg to a max range of only 640 m. Rate of fire is 25/min.

The most unsatisfactory factors in Germany unit I found is that they are the only country that do not have any heavy artillery with size bigger than 150 mm. Making them on later part of the game the only one better not to buy off board artillery since it is a fact that counter artillery in our game is normally bigger gun countering smaller gun. So if you used 8 inch American or British or 203 which is also 8 inch by the Russian. At later part of the war, they are near equal to German unit and they always counter German 150 gun.

What I found out that the German had a Krupp 21 cm Mrs 18 artillery. It is acutally issued to GErman unit in 1936. This gun was replacing another 21 cm normally called a Long 21cm Mortar deslgned in 1916. The gun shared the same carriage with 17 cm gun 18 (which is also used by the German).

I actually had some picture to replace those in our game but nobody ask for them.

This is how the 21cm look like see below.

I have lot of small little picture of 85 mm AA, some different view of Russian guns.... interested?

[o4r]

Ok, the so called "knee Mortar" by Allied.......

[o4r]

A look at 12.8 cm Pak 44 which is a photograph in our SPWAW.

Can somebody off that 60 second thing and allow me to attach more than 1 pictures.

Many thanks to those fxxking idiot who spam this site.....make us so troublesome...... mother fxxker why they got nothing better to do. Forcing the admin to enforce this to prevent spamming.

[o4r]

The Krupp L2H143 or the one that accompany the 2 * 81 mortar. It has a AA MG but the photograph didnt show. Ok, here is one that had it. It is also called Krupp Kfz 81.