ORIGINAL: Orm
ORIGINAL: warspite1
One further point I would like to make - and I guess its less of a point but more of a question.
As I understand it, an independent Scotland would vote for EU membership.
If that is right, here is the bit that I find really puzzling and leads to my question.
Firstly the EU, regardless of whatever the "official" line is, is an organisation devoted to ultimately creating a United States of Europe. When Britain voted to enter the Common Market (or not) we were never told this - but of course that was the point (as it would frighten voters off). Instead, with every passing year so more and more sovereignty of the member states is ceded to Brussels.
With that being the case, why are Scots (those who want an independent Scotland) desperate to throw off the "shackles of Westminster", but quite happy to be ruled by Brussels?
But are they not already ruled by Brussels?
The vote for Independence is about removing the fiscal shackles of Westminster and having a country who's vote counts.
You are assuming the people of Scotland want to be in the EU. I do not know that they do either way and have not seen any polls to suggest they do or do not...but that is a future question.
The Independence drive is fuelled by a very successful and relatively respected government in power in Holyrood. They are respected because they have stuck to their manifesto which got them elected. That is why they had a landslide victory.
What Scotland has at the moment is a government in Holyrood it voted for overwhelmingly but which is tethered by a government they didn't vote for in Westminster.
Now - to the EU.
The fact that the SNP is driving Independence means they are putting their future plans on the table. They want to, but are also being kind of forced to. I've seen all sorts of "independent" debates gunning for them and focussing on issues which, for the most part, are not related to independence - but are an SNP's view of Scotland...something which may or may not bear fruit.
For example - the SNP have stated they will remove the Nuclear deterrent from Scotland.
They have stated they will remove the bedroom tax.
They have stated they would apply to be a member of the EU.
They have stated many things in their white paper.
They have done so because they are the party in power and they are stressing, time and again,
this is their vision IF THEY ARE RE-ELECTED IN AN INDEPENDENT SCOTLAND in 2016
But they may not be. Independence will take about 18 months apparently to be effected and in that time all things relating to the union will have to be debated and argued.
Again - they may not be in power in 2016. It could be a new government in Scotland may well take Scotland out the EU. No-one (afaik) has asked the Scottish people if they wish to be in the EU! The new government in 2016 in Scotland may well keep the Nuclear deterrent.
But in direct answer to your question - the EU does not control Scotland's fiscal policies. Westminster does. Scotland may well apply to the EU for membership and in a few years time, if it looks like it's becoming more federal and/or they are sticking their beaks into fiscal matters that directly affect Scotland's ability to grow then they may well opt out of that then also.
For the record, a lot of people do not like Alex Salmond. A lot of voters are going to vote no because of that...however more and more people are understanding, regardless of how the Better Together campaign paint it, that the vote is NOT a vote for Alex Salmond or the SNP - it is PURELY a vote for Independence.
I have watched Westminster dismantle Scotland's industry (and lay waste to a lot of the North of England also!). I have watched Westminster introduce the Poll Tax in Scotland to "see how it goes". I have watched Westminster reduce the Armed forces to a shell, and further do so. I have watched Westminster waste millions (billions) on worthless contracts. I watched Westminster waste billions on Black Wednesday. I watched Westminster loot the gold reserves. I watched Westminster stand there and say "we're in it together" whilst removing a 5p in the pound for people earning £150,000 and punishing the most vulnerable in our society. I watched Somerset sit underwater for months with virtually no acknowledgment from Westminster and saw them come out and say "Money is no object" as soon as the Thames threatened it's banks.
Those are the things I have witnessed from Westminster. It's time for a change and Scotland has the chance to do it.
It may not result in change...afterall, who really trusts any of these buggers - but
it's a chance. And we can always vote them out...unlike Westminster where, again, we rarely affect the vote.
. That sort of thing was just designed to make the Scots think the English don't care [:(]