2x3+ Team Side Game - BOTH SIDES

[Mamluke]

Ho thanks telemecus!, I've only played PBEM with the multiplayer server, I guess its incorrect to call it PBEM.

[Telemecus]

Or even PBEM - should be "play by dropbox" [:D]

[Lictuel]

Since I don't want to semi-necro the sign-up thread:

If the German side of this game needs a ground commander in the future I'd be up for that.

[Telemecus]

Confirmed - welcome Lictuel to the Axis team!

[Neogodhobo]

Sometime I hate this game about how unrealistic it is.

The attack on Moscow saw 11,000 Germans assaulting the defended city. The defenders in that ONE SIDE of the city was 12,000 men. They had ample supply to defend.

How is it that we got 11,000 casualties, against 200 casualties for the Germans ?!?!? How does that even make sense. I can tell you what, if the Germans would have launched such an attack, on such a defended city, the Capital of the Soviet Union on top of that, German casualties would have been WAY higher. I mean, it would have been one of the most gruesome battles to take place.

I dont understand the logic of the game in that matter. Someone definitely need to get in contact with the dev team and try to get them to find a solution to emulate war a bit better than just mathematics or need to explain why Im wrong because Im lost here.

[SparkleyTits]

I imagine your defenders were very low on ammo even though they had supplies dropped it does not give ammo

I also had a lot more than 11k people I attacked with 2 dedicated inf corps and an extra division from another inf corp!

[Telemecus]

Where is M60A3TTS when you need them? [:)]

[Neogodhobo]

I swear by toutatis, this is not over ! My only goal now is to capture Berlin with less than 200 casualties !

[Telemecus]

If that were to happen I would immediately write to the developers at how the game is unrealistic, completely imbalanced against the Axis, and needs to be recoded accordingly [:D]

[Crackaces]

ORIGINAL: Neogodhobo

Sometime I hate this game about how unrealistic it is.

The attack on Moscow saw 11,000 Germans assaulting the defended city. The defenders in that ONE SIDE of the city was 12,000 men. They had ample supply to defend.

How is it that we got 11,000 casualties, against 200 casualties for the Germans ?!?!? How does that even make sense. I can tell you what, if the Germans would have launched such an attack, on such a defended city, the Capital of the Soviet Union on top of that, German casualties would have been WAY higher. I mean, it would have been one of the most gruesome battles to take place.

I dont understand the logic of the game in that matter. Someone definitely need to get in contact with the dev team and try to get them to find a solution to emulate war a bit better than just mathematics or need to explain why Im wrong because Im lost here.

Baring realism .. I just looked at the combat. About a 1/3 of the forces were disrupted by an air attack. That happened before any ground shooting occured. Given multipliers that really reduced your AV. You are isolated and thus the isolation rules took over and the forces surrendered.
I do think the combat algorithm needs some work. The ability to stand or die, meaning extra combat rounds occurring at range '0' with units taking morale checks becoming disrupted or attacking for another round. This could be modified by leader political checks, initiative checks, morale etc ... Soviet fanaticism, compute morale checks and if exceeded by 'X' the device/squad is immune to disruption Thus must be damaged or destroyed). Combine these two features and rare but possible German losses would be possible.
Simulations of things like the Battle of Brody where 100 German AFV's were smacked ...

[Telemecus]

Because the Axis team is really jealous of the Soviet team having an air commander we have decided to have one too. From next turn Crackaces will also be air commander for the Axis team! [8D]

[thedoctorking]

We are very happy with our air commander. It takes a while to work out how to coordinate air with ground operations, though. Very WW2.

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: thedoctorking

We are very happy with our air commander. It takes a while to work out how to coordinate air with ground operations, though. Very WW2.

Yeah - I have even written a team rule which I call the "Protocol" to co-ordinate it (lots of others titter at that - but you know why it is needed!)

[Darojax]

o7 Acting Soviet Supreme Commander here.

Not sure if we are using any special notification system, just wanted to let you Axis guys know your turn is up. : )

Good mud.. uh, I mean luck! ^^

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: Darojax

o7 Acting Soviet Supreme Commander here.

Not sure if we are using any special notification system, just wanted to let you Axis guys know your turn is up. : )

Good mud.. uh, I mean luck! ^^

Cheers - this one is as good as any other - still welcome to join us on Discord though!

Edit:

Still a mystery why not?

[Darojax]

Yeah? Didn't know we were using it, please send me an invite link?

[Neogodhobo]

The soviets are not using Discord. The Germans are luring you into a trap Darojax -_-

[Neogodhobo]

22nd June, 1941.
2:30 am
Near the Bug River.

- "Comrade Ivanov, here is the report of our encounter with the enemy, send to Comrade Stalin"

It was a calm night, the moon was shining is light on our faces as the officer brought me his report.
Reports about the Germans again, what was it this time... Probably another one of those Recon plane
the Germans keep sending. {Sigh} , I lit my cigarette and sat on the bench inside of my tent. We were
located a bit behind Brest-Litovsk and were spending the night here on our way to Brest Fortress. I
shifted trough the first page of the report....

< 22/06/41. 0200.

At 0103 we saw someone swimming in the bug river. He was coming for us. We approach the person and saw that
it was a German soldier. He didnt have his uniform on and he was brandishing his under shirt, a white camisole
with the German empire ensigna on it. We took it as a surrender but approach carefully. Waiting on the bug
river banks with our rifle pointed at him, he came in panting and seemed alarmed. We brought him to a translator
as his Russian was too broken to understand.

At 0117, we learned that he was defecting the Germans to tell us of an imminent attack. The Germans are to launch
an assault in a few hours. Currently keeping him under guard. Send instructions.>

So the Germans are going to attack. At this moment the information was relayed to Stalin. His orders were clear.
The German was to be shot for spreading disinformation. All preparotary defense was to be canceled and routine to
go back to normal.

22nd June 1941
3:15
Max Kuhnert
cavalry reconnaissance unit

"At exactly 3.15 a.m., in the faint first light of day I was on my way to water the horses at the river when the whole
area exploded. All hell was let loose and I prayed for the strength to hold my two horses.
The noise and sight were indescribable, the earth seemed to tremble, all the batteries came alive out of the darkness
of the pine trees. Flames shot towards the border followed by the explosion of the shells on the other side. All around
us were what appeared to be great sheets of lightning, torn through by flames while thunder crashed and boomed.
The barrage kept on and on, no one could hear anything else and orders had to be given by hand signal. We were ordered
to march towards the river, where special units had already erected a pontoon bridge, over which, although we could not
hear them, we could see our tanks rumbling.

For an hour and a half the firing continued, and then we could hear the Russian planes attacking our invading troops;
many of them got shot down by our fighters.
Regimental Sergeant-Major Hamann told me to get over the river under my own steam, in other words, I was to get the
horses across, but not over the pontoon bridge as there was simply no room for the animals; in any case I believe the
horses would have panicked with the tremendous swaying of the bridge—it was a fast-flowing river."

The Germans had started their assault agains the Soviet Union. In 4 days only, they had destroyed over 4,000 aircraft,
destroyed 8 Soviet Regiments and Divisions along with 14 half finished fortified regions. They had killed over 54,000
Soviet soldiers, captured over 135,000 others, wounded over 97,000. They had destroyed over 1,400 tanks.

The Soviets fought hard but poor strategy from unexperienced officers made things difficult...
The Germans were marching en mass for Moscow....



(Currently trying to find a way to access early game save file of the Axis so that I cant write a proper run down of how the frontier battles went, stay tune )

[Neogodhobo]

256th I.D/456th I.R
1st Bn.
3rd Rifle Co.
Varena Outskirt
22nd June 1941, Dusk...

Gefreiter Otto Altenburg...

"Dusk was falling when the feld responsible for our section waved us over to him. We were soon listening intently, as he told us what we would
be expectedto do. He had a large map of the district, on wich he showed us the points we should attain, taking every precaution. When the order
was given, we should be prepared to advance. We were given a list of rallying points and other details wich I only partly understood, and advised to rest,
as we would not be called before the middle of the night.
We stood and starred at each other for a long time. Now we knew. We were going to be part of a full scale attack. A heavy sense of foreboding settled over us,
and the knowledge that soon some of us would be dead was stamped on every face. Even a victorious army suffers dead and wounded: The Fuhrer himself had sait it.
In fact, none of us could imagine his own death. Some would be killed, we all knew that, but each one imagined himself doing the burying. No one, despite the obvious danger, coul think of himself lying mortally wounded. That
was something wich happened to other people, thousands of them, but never to oneself. Everyone clung to this idea, despite fear and doubt. Even the Hitlerjugend, later in the war, who spent years cultivating the idea of sacrficice, couldnt consciously envisage their own ends
occuring withing a few hours. One might be exalted by a grand idea based on a structure of logic, and even be prepared to run large risks, but to believe in the worst is impossible.

Finally, night came : A soft summer night, wich brought with it a breath of freshness after the horrid day. Everywhere free of the war, people must have been stretched out on the grass beside their houses, enoying the season with their friends.
Sometimes when I was small, I used to take a walk with my parents before going to bed. My father believed one should enjoy these summer evenings to the maximum, and kept me out until my eyelids
drooped with sleep. My buddy Ernst pulled me back from my thoughts.
"My dear Otto, be sure to look out for yourself when we get going. It would be too stupid to get killed at opening days of the operation."
"Yes," I said. " That would be stupid."
All of us were haunted by so many thoughts that c onversation was impossible. And each of us was obsessed by the particular question : "How shall I come trough this time?"
In the depths of the covered shelter, one of the young soldier was playing quietly on his harmonica, and the voices of his companions joined softly in the melody. Then the sound of gunfire made us jump.
"Here we go" We thought.
But everything quieted down again.
Heinrich came up to us.
"The first Soviet line is less than four hundred yards from here," he said. " The feld just told me. Thats not very far."
"But its not too bad, either," said a Veteran. "At least we can sleep in peace. In France, one night we slept so close to the French, their holes were less than a grenade's throw from ours."
No one answered him.
"Im commanding group 6" Said Heinrich, " and I have to get right under Ivan's nose, to keep him from moving when the assault troops begin their attack. You can imagine..."
"Well have it about the same," said the sergeant who would lead us. "According to what Ivh eard, well be right in line with one of their positions".
We listened attenetively, hoping that our part of the enterprise was not going to be too dangerous.
"But the Sovietscouts are sure to see us!" cried Lindberg, horrified. "Thats Crazy!"
"That will be the hardest part of it, but lets hope the night is dark. Also, wev been advised not to fire before the attack, to get into position without any noise."
"Dont forget mines," said the veteran, who in fact had not gone to sleep.
"The ground was checked for mines by details from the disciplinary battalion, insofar as possible," the noncom retorted.
"Insofar as possible," sneered the veteran. "I like that!" All the same, youd better be careful if you see any wires. Dont go tugging them!"
"If you keep on like this," Heinrich shouted in a threatening voice, "Il put you to sleep until the attack."
He shook his stubby-fingered fist under the older man's nose. The Veteran only smiled, but didnt say anything.
"What if we run right into Ivan?" Asked Kraus. "Then well have to use our guns, wont we ?"
"Only as a last resort," the noncom answered. "In principle, were supposed to take them by surprise, and knock them out without any noise."

Without any noise! What did he mean?
"With the butts of our guns, or spades?" asked Ernst anxiously.
"Spades, bayonets, anything. Wev got to get rid of them, thats all. And without raising any alarm."
"Well take them prisoner," murmured young Herbert.
"Are you off your rocker?" said the noncom. "An assault group cant take prisoners during a mission. What would we do with them?"
"Hell," said Ernst. "You mean well have to skewer them?"
"Lost your guts?" Asked Heinrich.
"Hell, no." said Ernst, to show that he was a man. But his face was white.

I glanced at the spade-pick hooked on to my big friend's waist. Then we had to stand up so a Hauptmann and his group could get trough.
"Where are we exactly?" young Herbert ask naively.
"In Russia" said the veteran.
No one smiled at this feeble joke, and the noncom tried to give us a rough idea of our position. North-west of Varena.
"Im going to try and sleep" stammered Ernst, who was clearly shaken by all these preparations.
We lay down side by side, without bothering to under our bedrolls. The steel of the spandau wich Ernst had set up pointing down the lenght of the trench gleamed with a dull luster. Sleep was impossible, not because of the discomfort
of a night out of doors, strapped into all our gear, wed done that often before, but because of our anxiety about what lay ahead.
"Hell, Il have plenty of time to sleep when Im dead," said Kraus in a loud voice. He stood up and pissed against the wall of the trench.

I lay awake for a long time, thinking and thinking... Finally, I did sleep, for about three hours, until I was wakened by the distant sound of a motor. My movement woke Ernst and Grumpers, who was lying beside me with his head on my shoulder.
"Whats the matter?" He groaned sleepily.
"I dont know. I thought maybe theyd called us."
"What time is it?" asked Ernst.
I looked at my watch. "Two-Twenty."
"What time is dawn?" asked young Herbert, who hadnt been able to sleep at all.
"Probably very early this time of year" someone said.
The sound of engines continued.
"If those fucking drivers keep it up, theyll wake every one of the goddamm Russkis."

We tried to go back to sleep, but couldnt. About half an hour later we heard a muted noise of bustle and commotion just beyond the walls of the covered shelter. In the darkness, we guessed that we were listening to some fellows collecting their
gear. We all turned towards the sound, trying to grasp what was happening, when a feld appeared, wearing camouflage.
"Group 8 and 9?" He asked in a low voice.
"Present!" answered the two group leaders.
"Youll be leaving in five minutes, by way of access C, and will proceed to your respective positions. Good Luck!"
He pointed to a small sign, scarcely visible in the darkness, marked with a letter C. All our reflections came to a dead stop, and our brains emptied, as if we had been anesthetized. Everyone grabbed his gun, and checked the critical points of his harness
and straps, as Hauptmann Fink had taught us, especially the chin straps of our helmets. Ernst lifted the big F.M onto his shoulders and Herbert, who was his number-two man, slipped his slender silhouette in beside the man he was supposed to serve.
Only the Veteran, our second machiner gunner, behaved as if hed forgotten the object of all these preparations. His movements were not marked by the febrile haste wich characterized the actions of all the rest of us. He knew all this from before. He propped
the heavy F.M against his leg, and waited for the order to move out.
"I hope your in good shape," he said to the gun, grinning sardonically.

"Group 8!" Called the sergeant, sounding as if hed been struck by a sudden electric shock. "After me, and silence!"
We took exit C and, sticking close together, followed the trench to the forward positions. Our noncom was at the head of the column. Behind him came Grumpers, Karl, who was about twenty-two years old. Then Ernst, just past eighteen, and Herbert, not quite
seventeen, then our three gunners : A Czech of indefinable age with an unpronounceable name, a Sudeten of nineteen, whose name ended with an "a", and me. Right behind me was the veteran with his number two man, another terrified boy, and finally, Kraus,
who must have been well into his twenties. We moved out in good order, exactly as wed been taught at Camp F., where wed sweated so hard.
Indefinable noises reached us, coming from either the Soviet or the German lines. We crossed severak trenches jammed with troops who were still half asleep in the warm summer air, before climbing out of our own trench in the middle of the woods. Young Herbert,
who was loaded down like a donkey, slipped on the earth embankment, and the magazines of the spandau he was carrying clashed together. The noncom grabbed him by the straps and helped him climb up. Then he glared at him furiously, and kicked him in the shin.
We walked to the edge of the wood in a single file. The noncom stopped short very suddenly, and we all more or less piled into each other.




Part two coming later, maybe tomorrow, maybe next week.
(Slightly modified transcript from "The Forgotten Soldier")

[Neogodhobo]

256th I.D/456th I.R
1st Bn.
3rd Rifle Co.
Varena Outskirt

Gefreiter Otto Altenburg's memoir...

Far to our left, the dance had already begun: A dance wich would surely have inspired Saint-Saens, and wich lasted for hours.
A moment later, among the German troops we were watching, someone must have pulled a wire attached to a string of mines. Our
immediate surroundings, the Soviet position, and all of our hearts, were shaken by a seriues of thunderous explosions.
For a moment we thought that the whole mass of creeping soldiers we had seen just the minute before had been blown to pieces.
Everywhere among the assault troops, for they had been crawling towards us, young men were jumping up and trying to rush trought
the tangles of barbed wire. Ernst had just opened fire. The veteran slammed our gun shut and fitted it into the hollow of his shouler.
"Fire!" shouted the noncom. "Wipe them out!".

The Soviets ran to take their places. The string of 7.7 cartridges slid trough my hands with brutal rapidity, while the noise of the gun burst against
my eardrums.
I could see what was happening only with the greatest difficulty. The Spandau was shuddering and jumping on its legs, and shaking the veteran, who kept trying to steady himself.
Its percussive bark put a final touch on the vast din wich had broken out. Throught the vibrations and smoke, we were able to observe the horrible impact of our projectiles
on thet lost mass of Red soldiers in the trench in front of us. Day broke over the frenziedscene, and the sky slowly ligthened. From far behind us, German artillery was roaring trough every tube, pounding
the enemy's secondary positions. The Soviets, taken by surprise, were attempting a desperate defense, but from every side, the Whermacht were surging out of the darkness, breaking like waves over their entrenchements
and pulverizing both men and material. An overwhelming din engulfed the plain, wich rang with the sound of thousands of explosions.
Ahead of us, and far to the right, we were bombarding the town. Slow spirals of smoke some fifty yards across rolled along the ground from enormous fires. I was feeding a second magazine into our infernal machine,
and the veteran continued to pour his projectiles onto the dead and living who were jammed in to the advanced Soviet position. Then, trough all the noise, we heard the unmistakable rumble of tanks.
"our Panzers!" shouted the Czech with a demoniac laugh.
Ernst left his poition and rushed toward us with a leap wich made us think hed been hit. He and Herbert had run just in time. A second later, a huge tank rolled over the ground they had occupied,
crushing the barbed wire beneath its treads. The churned-up earth continued to shake with the explosions of mines, wich here and there immobilized a heavy armored vehicle, or tossed a landser some fifteen yards.
The tank, followed by two others, passed very close to us, trhusting towards the enemy position we had already been peppering for several minutes. In no time, it had crossed the trench, wich was overflowing with
bodies of Soviet soldiers. Then a second and a third tank plunged trough the bloody paste, and rtoleld on their treads stuck with horrible human remnants. Our noncom g ave an involuntary cry of horror
at the sight. Soon the young soldiers fresh from the sportive pleasures of the barracks would arrive at this foul reality. We heard a cry of horror, followed by one of victory, as the first assault wave
continued its advance. More tanks were pouring out of the woods behind us, crushing the saplings and brush, and driving, almost rearing up on their treads, were any wounded lying on the ground, that was their bad luck...

German Soldiers celebrating their victory at Varena

(Slightly modified transcript of "The Forgotten Soldier - Guy Sajer" )
(Keep in mind, in the actual battle in the game, there were no tanks but this part was too good to leave it out. Sue me.