Vulnerable location hit

Gordon_freeman · Post by **Gordon_freeman** » Fri Jun 01, 2001 11:30 am

First of all, like all of your stories about these hits, like the 46 hit's on the truck, thanks!
But what allways gets me is when a small/light tank is hit by the dreaded 88 and still gets away with 3 hits telling me front turret hit, front armour hti and so on, then in return, My crew dies in MG fire.
I remeber still SP1, put the game on the "hard" level, had a Jagdtiger and hit a Stuart for 6 times, not killing it!
Up to now i call those crew "brothers of the holy one"...

Charles2222 · Post by **Charles2222** » Fri Jun 01, 2001 5:27 pm

Flashfyre: Well that's a real fight to the death, isn't it? The crew who had their thread blown off assaults another tank. In so doing that tank has survivors most likely, and then the REAL fighting starts (crew vs. crew). Actually I don't think I've ever seen that happen, as my crews get out of the action if possible.

[ June 01, 2001: Message edited by: Charles_22 ]

Dan Bozza · Post by **Dan Bozza** » Fri Jun 01, 2001 8:48 pm

Originally posted by Charles_22:
Flashfyre: Well that's a real fight to the death, isn't it? The crew who had their thread blown off assaults another tank. In so doing that tank has survivors most likely, and then the REAL fighting starts (crew vs. crew). Actually I don't think I've ever seen that happen, as my crews get out of the action if possible.
[ June 01, 2001: Message edited by: Charles_22 ]

It's happened to me a couple of times - took a long time for one to finish the other off. Hit chances never rose above 15% or so, even at 1 hex range.

[ June 11, 2001: Message edited by: Boz ]

Charles2222 · Post by **Charles2222** » Fri Jun 01, 2001 9:46 pm

Maybe if they succeed very much in hand-to-APV fighting, their infantry rating should go up.

Charles2222 · Post by **Charles2222** » Fri Jun 01, 2001 9:53 pm

BTW, a note on kills, which everyone might've noticed by now, and it is slightly annoying. During bombardment in particular, casualties are often not displayed where they used to be, that is in the portion of the screen where you're getting direct fire reports. They are often showing up in the log instead, so they are being reported, it's just that your eyes have to become a yo-yo to try to keep track of whether troops are being lost.

Gloo · Post by **Gloo** » Mon Jun 11, 2001 6:37 pm

Originally posted by Paul Vebber:
Read a few Medal of Honor citations...how does anyone do any heroic action? Maybe they found a PF lying around...or a bunch of grenades?

Well, why not actually.

But I never saw a MG crew assaulting anything coming close to them... ! Maybe they have no eagle eye to notice that bunch of grenade lying around and that's why they are given care of a MG? No need to be a sharpshooter to strafe the landscape with such a toy

Flashfyre · Post by **Flashfyre** » Mon Jun 11, 2001 7:54 pm

Flashfyre: Well that's a real fight to the death, isn't it? The crew who had their
thread blown off assaults another tank. In so doing that tank has survivors most
likely, and then the REAL fighting starts (crew vs. crew). Actually I don't think I've
ever seen that happen, as my crews get out of the action if possible.

[ June 01, 2001: Message edited by: Charles_22 ]

I just finished a PBM game with a friend of mine, German/Soviet meeting engagement, where our armor forces (1 company StuGs/2 Tigers against 1 company T-34s/2 KV-2s) met in a valley and virtually annihilated each other. Many crewmen left, and the VHs were points-per-turn style. Infantry on both sides still "legging" it to the front, so the crews went at it. Roughly equal results for each of us; most crews killed, a couple of melee attacks, and one assault (my Russian crew against a StuG, which failed and got them blown away).

It was a bloody day for the Motherland, but many Nazi soldiers went back to the Reich in body bags. And a huge pile of scrap iron was left in the valley. Only 3 StuGs survived the massacre, and they turned tail and fled to the rear.

When the fighting starts, use whatever troops are at hand. Just because the crew had their tread shot out from under them doesn't mean they can't contribute to the war effort.

Easy8 · Post by **Easy8** » Tue Jun 12, 2001 12:37 am

Played a long campaign scenario recently, US vs Ger. Had Shermans destroy a Tiger, 2 Pz V, and a Pz III with bottom hits by .50 cal AAMG's. German tanks were at 1 hex range and charging down slopes. Interesting, because I have played all versions of SP since 1996 and have NEVER seen this before or since.

Igor · Post by **Igor** » Tue Jun 12, 2001 5:30 am

I posted a message about this in the bug report thread about a shooting gallery I had set up; basically, small arms/MGs can kill a vehicle if they score a vulnerable location hit on a face where their HE kill factor is greater than the armor. When I tried it, it worked out to about one kill/damage per three VL hits.

It was explained to me that this was a side effect of another change; the HE kill of a machine gun is being treated by the game like the HE kill of a shell or bomb. However, as it also simulates the effect of lots of MG fire at vision ports and such like, it should be regarded as a fix rather than a bug.

FWIW, .50 MGs are treated as firing AP ammo when shooting at armor; so the bottom hit on the tiger probably didn't need a VL result to punch through, it could do it the old fashioned way