Noumea--To Take or Not to Take?!!

[John 3rd]

I could reinforce the theatre with Zeros and Bettys. I could also wait for Tojos and Tonys in August and make re-fitting in Burma #1 Priority. What about that?

If Moses refuses to deploy his carriers for the Australia thrust, then I could easily send the KB in that direction towards Burma. He would probably think they were heading home for refit... My CBA would certainly chew up his Hurricanes and other fighters...

[niceguy2005]

Just my two cents. Is it possible for you to use Nomeau as a decoy? I think my priorities in the area would be.
1. Isolate it if possible and make him work hard to resupply.
2. Try a couple of faints to keep his attention on it and off NE Australia.

Who knows, maybe you can goad him into putting some CV's in range of your long range bombers and you can pick off one or two.

[Sneer]

my two - cents- not woth to go there -
KB cann't secure whole area , unless enemy is broken and has lost all CV target is too risky.
once in AI game enemy raided Nomua twice successfully - human player will be even better.
I found myself having inadequate airforce in region as you need cover strong enought to stand 4 cv enemy raid + constant risk of easy bombarding airfield from NZ in bad weather ( I had this bad luck and had to evacuate) shipping line are terrible there and it doesn't cut supply routes for allies just delay convoys for a week or so - not worth!
consider also costs of taking this base in mid 42 - too high! certainly it will be extremaly difficult to inflict 4:1 losses in Nomua region

[JeffroK]

Work out what your priorities are:
Destroying CV's, Capturing Oil/Resources, Destroying LCU's

Then work out the safest place to do this, earlier comments about drawing the USN into your (substantial) Land based Air umbrella make much sense.

Dont split your forces too small, make a plan and go for it, dont make 3 plans and find that none are strong enough for success (You make be able to stagger them a bit to maximise support)

Give any plan a bash, you aint playing for Sheep Stations, are you?

[mc3744]

Just saw this.

I wouldn't attack.
Either you take Noumea by February/January and try to lock down the supplies to Australia or it's just one more base to defend and you already have enough. [;)]

[worr]

I don't think you ever said what was your score. The only reason I'd take it is to get the automatic victory.

You could take it, but you wouldn't be able to hold it.

Worr, out

[John 3rd]

I am leadeding Moses by about 10,000 VP but am no one near autovictory.

I continue to think about my plans.

I will make a double thrust--the immediate goals will be the capture of NE Australia. Since I have Suva, Efate, Luganville, PM, and GG, this should help to REALLY force Moses into a fight. I will use the land invasion to create an atmosphere that DEMANDS action. If he doesn't, then I will take the bases and force him to liberate here while I build-up elsewhere...

Second thrust, which will take longer to do, will be a limited invasion of Northern Burma/Eastern India. He has a lot of forces at Mandalay and preparing to resist me at Imphal. I will do an end-around with several divisions and support troops.

More thoughts...

[worr]

There are no points in the NE Aussie land.

Worr, out

[AmiralLaurent]

I don't see why an invasion of NE Australia will draw his CVs, especially if yours are in the area. Once you will land in Australia, you will probably find a lot of Australian troops unable to leave the country and ready to fight. Probably every town of NE Australia will be hold by a division rather than a brigade.

Probably the India option is the best at this time. Keep the KB in Pacific and a reserve of 3 divisions and wait for the incoming Allied offensive. Then try to crush it Guadalcanal-like... well better than Guadalcanal-like from Japanese POW[;)]

[John 3rd]

AdmiralLaurent--those are good thoughts. Lets see what everyone else throws out and see...

If I am CRAZY, let me know! If you have different, better ideas, chime in on the discussion...

[saj42]

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

Second thrust, which will take longer to do, will be a limited invasion of Northern Burma/Eastern India. He has a lot of forces at Mandalay and preparing to resist me at Imphal. I will do an end-around with several divisions and support troops.

More thoughts...

6 Inf divs plus all the Engr Regts and Armour you can spare

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: AmiralLaurent

I don't see why an invasion of NE Australia will draw his CVs, especially if yours are in the area. Once you will land in Australia, you will probably find a lot of Australian troops unable to leave the country and ready to fight. Probably every town of NE Australia will be hold by a division rather than a brigade.

Probably the India option is the best at this time. Keep the KB in Pacific and a reserve of 3 divisions and wait for the incoming Allied offensive. Then try to crush it Guadalcanal-like... well better than Guadalcanal-like from Japanese POW[;)]

I am still very new to this game and I am fascinated with the idea of an Australian invasion, but it also raises a lot of questions. I agree with AmiralLaurent that you are going to face serious opposition from the Ausie land units. They have no reason to retreat because they really don't have anywhere to go. Unless you plan to take all of Australia you can't hold the bases. Do the bases have enough points to justify the expenditure of resources? Can you blockade Australia and starve the troops enough to soften them up? If not, you may be better off reinforcing the pacific and going after India.

If I were the Allied player I might welcome an invasion. I could get you to commit lots of troops to Australia. Then, do my best to cut them off from resupply, maybe a campaign up the Solomons to isolate them. Of course, it sounds like a long time before your opponent will be ready for such a move.

[AmiralLaurent]

I won't land in Australia with less than 10 divisions... except in the NW part (Darwin-Broome) in early 1942, where I landed twice successfully in PBEM.

Any Australia invasion is the place to send all Japanese armor. Terrain is often good for them and the only chance of the Japanese forces is to overwhelm a given area, surround some Aussies divisions and destroy them. Knowing moses I won't engage against him in a land campain where I start with inferior forces and supply problems.

[John 3rd]

You are truly right about dealing with Moses on the ground. I have been kicked around China like a punching bag! This is a VERY good safety tip!

[kaiser73]

If he has 3 Divs in Noumea, i would go for Noumea. But i would bring:
1) All BB TFs to damage his ports
2) All CV to defend invasion fleet (do NOT waste pilots bombing airfields, he will kill tons of your pilots)
3) I would bring a serious force (All SRA divs but 4 to defend Burma) and all Brigades. so should be like 7 divs and 7 Brigades.
4) Most of zeroes groups.

I would land in the base north of Noumea (La foa). He can't defend properly both Noumea and La foa. Then i would build airfields to lvl 4 and i would damage with BB Noumea to keep him busy.

The key is to keep Noumea Base shutdown for the whole time.

I personally would never go for Townsville..you have an idea of australian forces? with 2 Divs you will *maybe* take the city but then you would have 5 aussies divs. and he won't be forced to use his CV. he doesn't need to. he has many aircrafts and divs in Australia, why should he try?

I would personally never go for Noumea with less than i mentioned earlier. or you just going to lose CV and troops.
it is still a risk (in june he can have lot of f4f and lb there and CAP not always stop everything) but at least the prize is nice (killing 3 US Divs will problably stop any Allied offensive in pacific for the next year). and if you win, you can try NZ (without 3 US divs he can't have much defending).

Moses is a veteran. He won't make mistakes. If he is waiting for you at Noumea, maybe it's wise not to go there.
Going for austrlia with less than 10 divs is just suicide IMO.

[John 3rd]

All these good thoughts are providing the chance for me to exercise my strategic confusion and frustration at trying to force a major battle in 1942 with my opponent. I still have the tools but need the vision.

Desired Priorities:
1. Force a major CV battle where I have a chance to defeat his carriers.
2. Try to inflict a defeat large enough to forestall an Allied Offensive in 1942.
3. Build-Up perimeter defences to delay the offensive once it starts.

Operational choices that might cause this to occur:
1. Wait for counterattack and strike back at that point with EVERYTHING.
2. Take New Caledonia--Koumac, La Foi, and then Noumea
3. Attack into Burma/India Useful resources and HI there.
4. Attack NE Australia

While I sit in confusion, Moses prepares for Option 1. He is slowly moving towards the belief that I will not go after Noumea. I wonder if I can use that to my advantage?

[ChezDaJez]

I will make a double thrust--the immediate goals will be the capture of NE Australia. Since I have Suva, Efate, Luganville, PM, and GG, this should help to REALLY force Moses into a fight. I will use the land invasion to create an atmosphere that DEMANDS action. If he doesn't, then I will take the bases and force him to liberate here while I build-up elsewhere...

If your opponent is currently using Australia as a staging area for future invasions, he may have plenty of troops to take back whatever you capture. If they are at Noumea, he can always transport them to Sidney/Brisbane ports and march up the roads. The loss of Noumea or the NE coast is not a major blow to the allies as long as NZ and Sydney are still in allied hands.

One thing you can count on is Moses will probably respond by building the hell out of suitable bases in Australia for his B-17s. If he does this, he can harass KB by assigning them to naval attack. Even if he never scores a bomb hit, he will still attrite your fighters, forcing KB to eventually withdraw for replacements not to mention the amount of fuel its going to take to keep KB in the fight. He will probably also flood the area with submarines to interdict supply shipping and might get lucky enough to put a torp in a CV. Once KB does leaves, that leaves your troops/airfields wide open to heavy bombing.

That's what I do if I were your opponent. There is no reason for Moses to commit his carriers against KB and LBA operating from New Guinea when heavy bombers will suffice. Don't forget you will also have to interdict his supply routes to Australia to prevent reinforcement and keep yours open.

If you want to hurt him and possibly draw out his carriers, send KB to the shipping lanes between between Suva and Pearl where his LBA is weakest.

Also be carfeul what you ask for, you just might get smacked by it (his carriers).

Just my .02 cents

Chez

[JeffroK]

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

All these good thoughts are providing the chance for me to exercise my strategic confusion and frustration at trying to force a major battle in 1942 with my opponent. I still have the tools but need the vision.

Desired Priorities:
1. Force a major CV battle where I have a chance to defeat his carriers.
2. Try to inflict a defeat large enough to forestall an Allied Offensive in 1942.
3. Build-Up perimeter defences to delay the offensive once it starts.

Operational choices that might cause this to occur:
1. Wait for counterattack and strike back at that point with EVERYTHING.
2. Take New Caledonia--Koumac, La Foi, and then Noumea
3. Attack into Burma/India Useful resources and HI there.
4. Attack NE Australia

While I sit in confusion, Moses prepares for Option 1. He is slowly moving towards the belief that I will not go after Noumea. I wonder if I can use that to my advantage?

John,

Your priorities 1 & 2 can be the same thing, recce the stuffing out of evry hiding hole you think his CV's are in, if you cant find his CV's you cant trap him.
You can do proiority 3 independently, once you decide where you want to base the defensive lines.

Your Operational choice 3 & 4 can be done with no/minimal use of your main striking forces, even the Australia Option would only need their use for a short time.

Choice 1 equals your priorities, and has the same problems. Have a think about what point you can attack where he WILL react, can you get it under YOUR land air support, maybe move a few SS's into the area, even a strong Surface fleet to mop up damaged units.

Choice 2, what are you gaining at what expense, It could be bloody, expense to maintain only to find a US Navy blitz through the Central Pacific which leaves them on a limb.

Lots of questions, few answers.

[Yamato hugger]

My .02.

Nomena isnt worth taking. You cant hold it for long without taking severe losses to your AK fleet. If you can hit and run it then fine do it. If he has 3 divs plus support you better plan to bring 9 if you going to do an in and out, otherwise dont bother. You will have to loiter too long in the area if you bring less.

Australia is a black hole. You can play ring around the rosie with the Aussie, but to what end? You cant trap and kill them, all you can do is push them around and train them to fight you later.

Better target is India. At least there you can push the Brits right off the map. Problem with this is again, sucks up a lot of units leaving nothing covering the US side of the war.

Japs really cant do much beyond the historical defensive paremiter except hit and run kill what you can and run raids.

[Feinder]

I started to type up a long dissertation about my own PBEM oppenent(s).

But I've decided against it.

I have one game where of the Hebrides Islands, Efate was successfully captured. It now has Port and AF with 99 damage. Wrecks of Zeros, Bettys, Mavis, Babs litter the airfield. And there are now has 17 LCUs that can rot there for all I care.

Suffice to say, I'd welcome an invasion of Noumea/Kumac/LaFoa or even Luganville. There is a LOT of stuff there. I'm not afraid of KB. I'm not afraid of BBs shelling the place.

Like the da man said, "Bring it on b_tch!"



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